Matt Capps and his looming option year

Sure glad Terry Ryan gave up a sandwich pick for this guy last offseason. Glad he put no thought into building his terrible minor league pitching staff. Ryan must be fired before the Twins waste all opportunity to cash in vets like Span, Morneau, ans Willy for some hard throwing boom or bust prospects. My guess is the clueless Ryan thinks it is better to lose 95 games with the old vets than to lose 100 with young guys building towards the future. The game has passed you by Mr. Ryan, do the right thing and step down.

Prospects, even sandwich picks, are still a long way from ML baseball.

There is just no way they bring him back. No way.

Capps would have been a Type B free agent. That would have netted them the 58th pick. In the middle of the winter they would have expected a Pavano, Liriano and Baker combo to healthy and have 15-16 wins each the next year, being optimistic, and Blackburn to be .500. You do need a closer if the three pitchers returned healthy and in in 2009-2010 form. If you think your squad has a chance, then you need a closer, not a pen of questions. The end result was players stepped forward.

I hated picking him up for another season instead of taking the pick but what is done is done.

Capps isn't the kind of "closer" that you "need." He's nothing more than a decent reliever, certainly not someone worth what you're paying plus a draft pick.

I'm sorry, but does this topic(or question) really warrant a 5 paragraph article to whether or not the Twins will pick up Capps option?
The obvious answer is: Hell no, and everybody already knows it was an awful trade/signing. I think people should focus more on QUALITY then Quantity of the "articles"

Originally Posted by SpiritofVodkaDave

I'm sorry, but does this topic(or question) really warrant a 5 paragraph article to whether or not the Twins will pick up Capps option?
The obvious answer is: Hell no, and everybody already knows it was an awful trade/signing. I think people should focus more on QUALITY then Quantity of the "articles"

Well, Cody does have to find something to write about almost every day .... and unfortunately I never underestimate the ability of the Twins front office to astonish us.

But I do think that Terry Ryan is too conservative (okay, I mean cheap) to pay Capps $6 million. But that doesn't mean I think there is 0% chance that Capps is back.

There's also the possibility that the Twins decline the option but bring him back for less money. He seems to be one of Gardenhire & Ryan's "guys" in terms of personality. (Okay, I'm holding my stomach now).

Maybe bring him back for 2 years. Someone needs to throw in the HR derby in 2014.

Capps is a good pitcher. I certainly wouldn't be opposed to taking the option. For me, the salary isn't a big issue unless it prohibits signing a free agent starting pitcher.

Originally Posted by SpiritofVodkaDave

I'm sorry, but does this topic(or question) really warrant a 5 paragraph article to whether or not the Twins will pick up Capps option?
The obvious answer is: Hell no, and everybody already knows it was an awful trade/signing. I think people should focus more on QUALITY then Quantity of the "articles"

It seems obvious to you and me, but the Twins have demonstrated twice now that they've got a love for Capps that goes beyond how he actually performs on the field.

It was obvious to me that signing Capps again in the offseason was a mistake, but the Twins did it anyway.

Originally Posted by YourHouseIsMyHouse

Capps is a good pitcher. I certainly wouldn't be opposed to taking the option. For me, the salary isn't a big issue unless it prohibits signing a free agent starting pitcher.

Even a healthy Capps is not worth the $6.25m difference between the option and the buyout. Pass.

Scott Baker won't get that much in 2013. Who would you rather see paid that money?

You can better spend any of the money. No need to even pay a Capps $2 million. He may be worth that, but bullpen at any price above that, for the moment, is not a necessity. I would rather see the Twins go after, say, a Jon Rauch again if there was the need. But Starting pitching and middle infield are the two places you need to spend. Spend Pavano and Baker money on one pitcher, spend Capps and Casilla money (and Marquis) on another. There, that was easy...........

Next year you can spend Toshi and Blackburn money on yet another pitcher or hitter......

The Twins have gotten a look at plenty of other options to fill-up the bullpen for next season and players like Alex Burnett, Anthony Swarzak, and Casey Fien will all come with a smaller price tag than Capps. There doesn't seem to be a place for him on the 2013 Twins but that doesn't mean he won't be back in Minnesota.

There are always players that come at a cheaper price tag than a veteran....that is only one factor. I'm not a Capps fan, and don't particularly ever want to see him pitch for the Twins again, but what it boils down to for me is that he's just a better pitcher Burnett or Swarzak. The Twins could fill out the bullpen with those other guys, but they'd have a better and deeper bullpen if they had Capps pitching in the 7th inning instead of Burnett. There's no way they should pick up his option, but there's no way any team is going offer Capps even $3 million next year. I'd offer him a $2 million deal with maybe an option/buyout for 2014 and tell him he can earn whatever bullpen job he can get in spring training. No other team will offer him any better than that, and the Twins will be better for having him around, and they should be able to afford the money.

My guess is that both Cappie and Pavano will be back; "They both battle and get after it. Go about their business the right way and provide veteran leadership" per Gardy after the signings!

Originally Posted by old nurse

Capps would have been a Type B free agent. That would have netted them the 58th pick. In the middle of the winter they would have expected a Pavano, Liriano and Baker combo to healthy and have 15-16 wins each the next year, being optimistic, and Blackburn to be .500. You do need a closer if the three pitchers returned healthy and in in 2009-2010 form. If you think your squad has a chance, then you need a closer, not a pen of questions. The end result was players stepped forward.

Your logic "If you think your squad has a chance, then you need a closer, not a pen of questions" is solid, but the choice of Capps was obviously incorrect. The Twins could have had a similar bullpen arm AND the pick.

Here are the 'closers' signed in 2012, their salaries (mil), and finally their 2012 WAR (FG):

1 YR Deals:
Matt Capps, 6, -0.1
Jonathan Broxton, 4, 1.3
Ryan Madson, 6, 0
Francisco Cordero, 4.5, -0.8
Octavio Dotel, 3, 1.5
Brad Lidge, 1, -0.2
Jon Rauch, 3.5, 0.4
Fernando Rodney, 1.75, 2.2
Francisco Rodriguez, 8, 0.3

Multi-YR Deals:
Heath Bell, 6, 0.4
Frank Francisco, 5.5, 0.1
Joe Nathan, 7, 1.7
Jonathan Papelbon, 11, 1.4

The Twins weren't eveer going to go multi-year on a 'closer', so looking only at that first group, the Twins could have had better production from nearly all of that group AND received a draft pick AND paid less is nearly every case.

This is why their logical was flawed for signing Capps.

Originally Posted by nick5253

Originally Posted by old nurse

Capps would have been a Type B free agent. That would have netted them the 58th pick. In the middle of the winter they would have expected a Pavano, Liriano and Baker combo to healthy and have 15-16 wins each the next year, being optimistic, and Blackburn to be .500. You do need a closer if the three pitchers returned healthy and in in 2009-2010 form. If you think your squad has a chance, then you need a closer, not a pen of questions. The end result was players stepped forward.

Your logic "If you think your squad has a chance, then you need a closer, not a pen of questions" is solid, but the choice of Capps was obviously incorrect. The Twins could have had a similar bullpen arm AND the pick.

Here are the 'closers' signed in 2012, their salaries (mil), and finally their 2012 WAR (FG):

1 YR Deals:
Matt Capps, 6, -0.1
Jonathan Broxton, 4, 1.3
Ryan Madson, 6, 0
Francisco Cordero, 4.5, -0.8
Octavio Dotel, 3, 1.5
Brad Lidge, 1, -0.2
Jon Rauch, 3.5, 0.4
Fernando Rodney, 1.75, 2.2
Francisco Rodriguez, 8, 0.3

Multi-YR Deals:
Heath Bell, 6, 0.4
Frank Francisco, 5.5, 0.1
Joe Nathan, 7, 1.7
Jonathan Papelbon, 11, 1.4

The Twins weren't eveer going to go multi-year on a 'closer', so looking only at that first group, the Twins could have had better production from nearly all of that group AND received a draft pick AND paid less is nearly every case.

This is why their logical was flawed for signing Capps.

For what it's worth, in my 2012 blueprint I had wanted the Twins to sign both Broxton and Dotel for a combined $8 million . . .

Originally Posted by YourHouseIsMyHouse

Capps is a good pitcher. I certainly wouldn't be opposed to taking the option. For me, the salary isn't a big issue unless it prohibits signing a free agent starting pitcher.

You could get two or three Capps for that money.


Or maybe some middle infield help. Or starting pitching help. Or new carpet in the corporate offices.

1)i see you blame bill smith ,even though it is known that terry ryan was his advisior and made all of the transactions during smith tenoras g.m.
2)guessing what terry(curly) ryan will do is never posible, as he seems to luv soft tossing pitchers, and last night crapps only could muster 89-90 mph

Originally Posted by nick5253

Originally Posted by old nurse

Capps would have been a Type B free agent. That would have netted them the 58th pick. In the middle of the winter they would have expected a Pavano, Liriano and Baker combo to healthy and have 15-16 wins each the next year, being optimistic, and Blackburn to be .500. You do need a closer if the three pitchers returned healthy and in in 2009-2010 form. If you think your squad has a chance, then you need a closer, not a pen of questions. The end result was players stepped forward.

Your logic "If you think your squad has a chance, then you need a closer, not a pen of questions" is solid, but the choice of Capps was obviously incorrect. The Twins could have had a similar bullpen arm AND the pick.

Here are the 'closers' signed in 2012, their salaries (mil), and finally their 2012 WAR (FG):

1 YR Deals:
Matt Capps, 6, -0.1
Jonathan Broxton, 4, 1.3
Ryan Madson, 6, 0
Francisco Cordero, 4.5, -0.8
Octavio Dotel, 3, 1.5
Brad Lidge, 1, -0.2
Jon Rauch, 3.5, 0.4
Fernando Rodney, 1.75, 2.2
Francisco Rodriguez, 8, 0.3

Multi-YR Deals:
Heath Bell, 6, 0.4
Frank Francisco, 5.5, 0.1
Joe Nathan, 7, 1.7
Jonathan Papelbon, 11, 1.4

The Twins weren't eveer going to go multi-year on a 'closer', so looking only at that first group, the Twins could have had better production from nearly all of that group AND received a draft pick AND paid less is nearly every case.

This is why their logical was flawed for signing Capps.

Those that signed a one year deal, what was their WAR the previous season? You would be basing your decision on what they have done and anticipate continuation. When used as a closer, what was Capps WAR when healthy? He wasn't this year.