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Sanchez is a two as well. After that, the class thins quickly.Quote:
Originally Posted by TheLeviathan
Except there really aren't any frontline pitchers. There are a bunch of #3s that people are touting better than that and Zach Grienke. So get used to this.Quote:
Originally Posted by SpiritofVodkaDave
I gotta say, I'm shocked at the low opinions of Dempster. This guy has been a 200 inning horse for something like 5 years. His xFIP each of those years is right around 3.7. Is it just the AL thing? To me, his stats are that of a clear #2 guy. Where is all the pessimism about him coming from? It seems a little crazy. What are you guys looking at?
Age, and the assumption a 3 year contract is needed in order to land him. Two years, as a bridge to the next contending team, would be a different story I think.Quote:
Originally Posted by John Bonnes
I think people are more down on his age and a three year contract than Dempster himself.Quote:
Originally Posted by John Bonnes
I like the way you think. :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Brock BeauchampI think people are more down on his age and a three year contract than Dempster himself.Quote:
Originally Posted by John Bonnes
Heh, yep. I know it's his decline phase and all that but I'd like Dempster at two years. I'm really torn on three. He'd be 38 at the end of that contract. I don't see how that would work out well for the Twins but they're going to have to pay somebody too much money.Quote:
Originally Posted by ashburyjohnI like the way you think. :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Brock BeauchampI think people are more down on his age and a three year contract than Dempster himself.Quote:
Originally Posted by John Bonnes
If you never overpay for a player, how would you handicap the future by doing so?that is, if they will not sign a player this year for too many years, so as to have money available in the future, why would you expect them to spend it in the future? There is an established market for free agents, ans those dollars are not going down. Why do you care if they break even, or make a lot of money?
This is probably where I'm at, too. I'd like to have somebody for at least 4 years honestly, but I'm not sure who I'd want to give that to. I'd love Greinke or Sanchez, but I can't imagine the Twins outbidding the rest of the league for either. After those two I'm not sure what to think. You've got older guys (Marcum, Dempster) or inconsistent guys (Jackson) or hurt guys (Haren). That's perfectly normal options for free agency, but it's hard to fall in love with any of them.Quote:
Originally Posted by Riverbrian
It depends on the guy. I'd love to have Jackson, Sanchez, or Greinke for four years. Dempster and Marcum, not so much.Quote:
Originally Posted by ericchri
Either way, Ryan needs to overpay for somebody. It's an ugly situation to be in but that's what five years of bad drafts (at least in the pitching department) gets a team.
Given his durability issues and lack of anything particularly flashy about his NL numbers, I would feel more comfortable classifying him as a very good 3.Quote:
Originally Posted by Brock Beauchamp
Eh, I don't know if I'd even argue with that. Tomato, tomahto.Quote:
Originally Posted by TheLeviathanGiven his durability issues and lack of anything particularly flashy about his NL numbers, I would feel more comfortable classifying him as a very good 3.Quote:
Originally Posted by Brock Beauchamp
I only argue it because it means I have trouble with calling him "frontline"Quote:
Originally Posted by Brock Beauchamp
I'm pretty liberal with #2/#3 rankings. To me, a number #3 is a guy who often pitches like a #2 but can't be relied upon to be well above average every year (say, Brad Radke). I think Sanchez is a little better than that (but not by much).Quote:
Originally Posted by TheLeviathanI only argue it because it means I have trouble with calling him "frontline"Quote:
Originally Posted by Brock Beauchamp
Hard for us to recognize, seeing as how we haven't had any in so long :-)Quote:
Originally Posted by Brock BeauchampQuote:
Originally Posted by TheLeviathanI only argue it because it means I have trouble with calling him "frontline"Quote:
Originally Posted by Brock Beauchamp
I'm pretty liberal with #2/#3 rankings. To me, a number #3 is a guy who often pitches like a #2 but can't be relied upon to be well above average every year (say, Brad Radke). I think Sanchez is a little better than that (but not by much).
NO, NO, NO, NEVER. He is Pavano, NO. I would rather sign no one and go with what we got then sign Dempster. He got tore apart in the AL last year. I would rather see Franky come back and that is making me puke in my mouth.
Yeah... It's like shopping in Warroad... The stores only have so much to offer. Still... It's where the shopping must be done. I wonder what Terry thinks of the winter meetings. Meetings and phone calls with people all day... Agents... GM's... Reporters hounding you for information... Mostly talking with folks who want to take advantage of you at every turn.Quote:
Originally Posted by ericchriThis is probably where I'm at, too. I'd like to have somebody for at least 4 years honestly, but I'm not sure who I'd want to give that to. I'd love Greinke or Sanchez, but I can't imagine the Twins outbidding the rest of the league for either. After those two I'm not sure what to think. You've got older guys (Marcum, Dempster) or inconsistent guys (Jackson) or hurt guys (Haren). That's perfectly normal options for free agency, but it's hard to fall in love with any of them.Quote:
Originally Posted by Riverbrian
From the outside it seems like a fun exciting time but I think for A GM... It would be a stressful time. I'd probably need an IV filled with scotch to wind down.
We don't need no pitching, just let polhads have all the money and be happy watching the last place Twins for another 4 years.
Warroad is a boom town!
Which is fair. My original point was more that if you're waiting to overpay only a "frontline" guy - it's pretty much Grienke you're waiting for. I can see your case for Sanchez, but I wouldn't classify him there. And that's primarily why he'd be on my list of guys not to overpay for. (overpaying him to be a class of pitcher I don't agree he's in)Quote:
Originally Posted by Brock Beauchamp
I don't think you can overpay for a pitcher unless he gets TJ. In 4 years pitching prices will go up another 10m a season.