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Thread: The Platoon "Efficiency and Efficacy" Advantage

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    The Platoon "Efficiency and Efficacy" Advantage

    MLB.com's Anthony Castrovince says that "platooning and position-sharing is here to stay" http://mlb.mlb.com/news/article/mlb/...&vkey=news_mlb :

    Platooning is increasingly in vogue in this era of pitching prominence and diminished offensive returns....

    Last season, according to Elias Sports Bureau, players batted in favorable matchups (right-handed batters against left-handed pitchers, and players vice versa) 56 percent of the time, the highest such percentage since 1995 (57) and an indication, perhaps, of the measures teams are taking to eke more efficiency and efficacy out of their offenses at a time when runs per game and league-wide batting averages have dipped to their lowest levels in decades.
    Not so surprisingly, the A's were right near the top, with 70.5% of their 2013 PAs under conditions that favored the hitter. More surprisingly, were the Indians, who edged out the A's at 70.6%, and the Twins, who were 5th at 60.4%. I think the Twins number was artificially inflated with all the switch hitters employed, as there wasn't any obvious platooning going on. By contrast, the A's are planning on platooning at 4 positions, and the White Sox, who finished at the bottom of the AL in favorable batting conditions, is now planning on full-time platooning at 3 positions in 2014.

    Strategic "position sharing" is a concept whose time has apparently arrived:

    Pure production, as you might have noticed from a winter in which three position players (Shin-Soo Choo, Jacoby Ellsbury and Robinson Cano) signed contracts of $130 million or more, can be awfully expensive. That's why such small-market clubs as the A's and Rays have long made a habit of maximizing the potential of their rosters through the use of timeshares.


    But this winter we're seeing several of the big spenders -- ...-- toy with, if not outright embrace, the idea as well.


    And it's why Danny Valencia might emerge as importance insurance for a Royals team with so much riding on Mike Moustakas, who has endured Ryan Howard-like struggles against southpaws thus far in his career. It's why the White Sox might squeeze one more effective season out of Paul Konerko, who will platoon with Adam Dunn at DH.
    Indians manager, Terry Francona, the 2013 champion of using the platoon advantage, summed up the impediments to successful implementation:


    "I think every manager would like to do it," Indians manager Terry Francona said. "You just can't always do it. You can't ever forget that they're people. So that's part of the communication. It's getting guys to understand that we're a team, and it's not all about personal numbers."
    Regardless, the Twins could benefit by arming Gardy with consideration of every potential and available platoon option that can possibly upgrade this underpowered 4-cylinder offense to at least a (Not So) Straight 6 engine. (To answer the bullpen-overuse concerns from the loss of ML pitching option, use more pitchers with options remaining as your depth, and shuttle them back and forth from Rochester).
    Last edited by jokin; 02-01-2014 at 11:52 PM.

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    Developing players over the next couple of years: Arcia, Buxton, Dozier, Hicks, Pinto, Sano. Player you would not platoon: Mauer. That leave SS and DH to platoon, unless you think the players are not going to develop.

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    Quote Originally Posted by The Wise One View Post
    Developing players over the next couple of years: Arcia, Buxton, Dozier, Hicks, Pinto, Sano. Player you would not platoon: Mauer. That leave SS and DH to platoon, unless you think the players are not going to develop.
    No, if this is the moneyball strategy that works you would then make a trade. Why have, for lack of a better comparison, .280 hitters everywhere when you can trade for a .290 hitter and be left with 2 .270 - .275 hitters at one position. The key to moneyball is that it is what drives your decisions. Your overall point is fine if your not playing moneyball.

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    I'm surprised the twins were 5th here. I know we talk about Gardy's reluctance to platoon quite a bit around here.

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    Please ban me! All-Star stringer bell's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by diehardtwinsfan View Post
    I'm surprised the twins were 5th here. I know we talk about Gardy's reluctance to platoon quite a bit around here.
    1) Switch-hitters would figure here. They can be regulars and always enjoy the platoon advantage. 2) From point 1, this is why I regard K Morales as very desirable for the Twins. I love the idea of Morales hitting between Mauer and the Hammer (later Sano). 3) The managers still have a tough time with platoons with 12-man pitching staffs. Teams can be constructed to maximize all of their roster and that would include a platoon or two. What is good is to have players with positional flexibility to figure into the mix. For example playing Escobar at third often against righthanders and sometimes at second vs. righties and use him at short vs. lefties. Further, if a regular (Mauer, Arcia, Willingham, Dozier) gets a day off, make sure it is when they don't have a platoon advantage and fill the spot with a guy who does have that edge.

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    Quote Originally Posted by The Wise One View Post
    Developing players over the next couple of years: Arcia, Buxton, Dozier, Hicks, Pinto, Sano. Player you would not platoon: Mauer. That leave SS and DH to platoon, unless you think the players are not going to develop.
    Hicks is probably a bad season away from being a platoon option.

    Quote Originally Posted by stringer bell View Post
    Further, if a regular (Mauer, Arcia, Willingham, Dozier) gets a day off, make sure it is when they don't have a platoon advantage and fill the spot with a guy who does have that edge.
    Bingo. Need a flexible bench that can do that.

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    Quote Originally Posted by stringer bell View Post
    Further, if a regular (Mauer, Arcia, Willingham, Dozier) gets a day off, make sure it is when they don't have a platoon advantage and fill the spot with a guy who does have that edge.
    what do you think Gardy did last year as he rated number 5 "platooner" by the definition of occasionally batting someone to a split advantage. Although I would like to point out there was no split advantage resting Mauer.
    Last edited by The Wise One; 02-03-2014 at 02:23 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mikecgrimes View Post
    No, if this is the moneyball strategy that works you would then make a trade. Why have, for lack of a better comparison, .280 hitters everywhere when you can trade for a .290 hitter and be left with 2 .270 - .275 hitters at one position. The key to moneyball is that it is what drives your decisions. Your overall point is fine if your not playing moneyball.
    Not a moneyball decision. If you have developed above average players at the positions, thats what you have. There is no need to platoon unless the other player is very superior at one thing but limited. If you have a collection of steady .280 hitters with 25 HR potential what is the problem with that?

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    Please ban me! All-Star stringer bell's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Wise One View Post
    what do you think Gardy did last year as he rated number 5 "platooner" by the definition of occasionally batting someone to a split advantage. Although I would like to point out there was no split advantage resting Mauer.
    Having switch hitters (Florimon, Doumit, Hicks, Escobar) automatically increases the numbers used in the article. Going deeper, using switch hitters with substantial platoon splits really doesn't improve production if they get substantial at-bats on their "weak" side. So, if Hicks got a day off (when he played every day) vs. a lefty or Florimon got a day off vs. a righty when he played against a lefty, it wouldn't be utilizing platoon advantages. Incidentally, Mauer hit very well against lefties last year, but his career platoon split is very stark. Career vs. righties: .932 OPS, career vs. lefties: .760 OPS
    Last edited by stringer bell; 02-03-2014 at 06:26 AM.

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    I'm not as concerned about platooning...

    I was much more concerned about players (who didn't earn it) playing every day.
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Wise One View Post
    Not a moneyball decision. If you have developed above average players at the positions, thats what you have. There is no need to platoon unless the other player is very superior at one thing but limited. If you have a collection of steady .280 hitters with 25 HR potential what is the problem with that?
    1. That's very difficult to do - it's a much more difficult target than developing a platoon that can produce at the same level.

    2. That team would become too expensive to keep very quickly, so it's not a sustainable strategy unless you're the Yankees. Actually, even the Yankees have trouble doing this because of pressure to keep (and overpay) their players beyond their productive years.

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    It is funny how a year can be a total outlier. As I stated, Mauer has a noticeable platoon split lifetime, but last year actually hit better against left handers. Michael Cuddyer, a career .270 hitter hit .330 last year in no small part because he killed right handed pitching to the tune of .360 BA. Cuddy has had a career where he's crushed left handers, but struggled against right handers, yet there he is with an OPS well north of .900 against RH pitching. Totally unsustainable, but for a season Michael Cuddyer and Joe Mauer defied their platoon splits.

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    Quote Originally Posted by The Wise One View Post
    Not a moneyball decision. If you have developed above average players at the positions, thats what you have. There is no need to platoon unless the other player is very superior at one thing but limited. If you have a collection of steady .280 hitters with 25 HR potential what is the problem with that?
    Of course if a player is to good to platoon you don't, but the option to trade into a platoon situation is the next step. Sometimes easier said then done, but we're looking at is a way of measuring WAP (wins over platoon) instead of WAR. Suddenly some very good high priced guys aren't as great. Hate to say it but this means if he would waive the no trade we should look to trade Mauer for baseball purposes.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mikecgrimes View Post
    Of course if a player is to good to platoon you don't, but the option to trade into a platoon situation is the next step. Sometimes easier said then done, but we're looking at is a way of measuring WAP (wins over platoon) instead of WAR. Suddenly some very good high priced guys aren't as great. Hate to say it but this means if he would waive the no trade we should look to trade Mauer for baseball purposes.
    Um, to improve our offense?
    Because there are so many better hitters out there?
    Did many platoons OPS better than .880 last year?

    Please help me understand how you reached this conclusion.

    Thank you
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    Quote Originally Posted by gil4 View Post
    1. That's very difficult to do - it's a much more difficult target than developing a platoon that can produce at the same level.

    2. That team would become too expensive to keep very quickly, so it's not a sustainable strategy unless you're the Yankees. Actually, even the Yankees have trouble doing this because of pressure to keep (and overpay) their players beyond their productive years.
    1. The developing talent that is coming through the pipeline to the majors should be given every chance to develop into being full time every day players. Your intent in drafting/signing prospects should be to develop the players to their fullest.

    2. When it gets to that point of being expensive then you can make trades for prospects that you think will fit the bill for the first response, You can also be very pleased with your scouting department.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Oldgoat_MN View Post
    Um, to improve our offense?
    Because there are so many better hitters out there?
    Did many platoons OPS better than .880 last year?

    Please help me understand how you reached this conclusion.

    Thank you
    Mauer is worth nowhere near his contract at this point. If you could unload him use his money throughout the roster you would do it. Of course Mauer is greater then a platoon but if a platoon at first of Sano and anyone is an option you consider it. We won't be able to trade Mauer anyways but this is what teams like Oakland try to do and it works.

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    Quote Originally Posted by stringer bell View Post
    It is funny how a year can be a total outlier. As I stated, Mauer has a noticeable platoon split lifetime, but last year actually hit better against left handers. Michael Cuddyer, a career .270 hitter hit .330 last year in no small part because he killed right handed pitching to the tune of .360 BA. Cuddy has had a career where he's crushed left handers, but struggled against right handers, yet there he is with an OPS well north of .900 against RH pitching. Totally unsustainable, but for a season Michael Cuddyer and Joe Mauer defied their platoon splits.
    Career .297/.330 split. He sure does hit poorly against left handed pitching. .790 OPS, he shouldn't be anywhere near the field of play with that poor of number. You are correct that there is a difference lifetime in his splits. His days off probably should be against left handed pitching on the road.
    Cuddyer is listed as a career .272 hitter against righties and .287 against lefties.
    Last edited by The Wise One; 02-03-2014 at 12:22 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by stringer bell View Post
    Having switch hitters (Florimon, Doumit, Hicks, Escobar) automatically increases the numbers used in the article. Going deeper, using switch hitters with substantial platoon splits really doesn't improve production if they get substantial at-bats on their "weak" side. So, if Hicks got a day off (when he played every day) vs. a lefty or Florimon got a day off vs. a righty when he played against a lefty, it wouldn't be utilizing platoon advantages. Incidentally, Mauer hit very well against lefties last year, but his career platoon split is very stark. Career vs. righties: .932 OPS, career vs. lefties: .760 OPS
    Your analysis of the other managers on the top of the list revealed a different pattern than Gardenhire's

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    Quote Originally Posted by diehardtwinsfan View Post
    I'm surprised the twins were 5th here. I know we talk about Gardy's reluctance to platoon quite a bit around here.
    What's hilarious is that Gardy openly shuns platoon's but does everything in his power to make sure his relief pitchers always match up with the opposing batter. Why not go through five relievers every single game?

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    Quote Originally Posted by notoriousgod71 View Post
    What's hilarious is that Gardy openly shuns platoon's but does everything in his power to make sure his relief pitchers always match up with the opposing batter. Why not go through five relievers every single game?
    If there's managin' to be done, Gardy is ON IT.

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