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Thread: Berardino: Willingham wants to finish career with Twins

  1. #41
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    If Hicks can hit .260-275 with 10-15 Home runs , how is that not an improvement over any player we had in the outfield last year? Maybe in 2 or 3 years he would be regulated to a 4th outfielder or trade bait, But Me thinks if we get that kind of production and solid D from him this year , he will end up being our best outfielder in 2014

  2. #42
    Twins News Team All-Star TheLeviathan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DocBauer View Post
    Also, I want to echo statements made that it is ridiculous to pigeon hole Arcia as a DH so early. He won't even turn 23 until after the season starts. He has a decent arm with enough athleticism that he began his career as a CF. He was not only a rookie getting his feet wet at the ML level last year offensively, but defensively as well, bouncing between RF as well as LF. Give him a chance to gain some experience and additional coaching before earmarking him as a full time DH.
    Citing where he started his career is pretty irrelevant, IMO. Plouffe and Cuddyer started as shortstops, that doesn't mean they belonged there in the majors.

    Should Arcia get more opportunities this year to get better? Absolutely. But he was pretty dreadful and his instincts looked even worse last year. Given the group coming up behind him, it may be worthwhile to start getting him adjusted earlier to the mental part of DHing rather than pretending he's something he's not.

  3. #43
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    IF Buxton, Hicks and Rosario can all play in the majors, where would you plan to play Arcia, assuming Dozier is playing 2B? It sin't about pigeon holing, not for me.....it is about getting the best players on the field, in their best positions. Arcia will never be the defender any of those three are.
    Lighten up Francis....

  4. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kwak View Post

    The Twins need offense--and only getting CF numbers from a corner OF really hurts. The Twins are already facing the power droughth potential at 1B with Mauer (reference Morneau's pre-injury numbers and use those as the needed standard of performance at 1B). Repeating that for a corner OF dilutes the positive effect of (the hoped for) big numbers from 3B when Sano is promoted. Being "league-average" should not be a goal--the Twins need to be better than league average. Hicks has to show "it" ASAP! Then he could be traded to solve problems elsewhere.
    Good defense and good pitching at least will keep you in games. Until a 30 HR guy that plays good defense comes along, Hicks will work.

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    johnnydakota (02-18-2014)

  6. #45
    Quote Originally Posted by johnnydakota View Post
    If Hicks can hit .260-275 with 10-15 Home runs , how is that not an improvement over any player we had in the outfield last year? Maybe in 2 or 3 years he would be regulated to a 4th outfielder or trade bait, But Me thinks if we get that kind of production and solid D from him this year , he will end up being our best outfielder in 2014
    Absolutely, I would much rather watch Hick's develop than watch Presley. Let's see what we have in him. If he develops enough offensively to play a corner spot, great. If not, he should have plenty of offense as a CF. Trade him when he establishes himself at the ML level AND when the offer is right. Two years from now we will also know what we have in Arcia, Rosario, Kepler, Walker, and others.

    Who knows, ther right offer could come along for Dozier and Rosario ends up at 2B. Let's develop some assets and then move pieces when it becomes more obvious how to round this team into a contender.
    Last edited by Major Leauge Ready; 02-18-2014 at 08:26 AM.

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  8. #46
    Please ban me! All-Star stringer bell's Avatar
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    It is interesting that so many think of Hicks' defense as elite. IMHO it wasn't even average last year. He displayed the tools to be very good, but he had a bunch of bad jumps and misplays, especially early in the season. On the Arcia discussion, if he fails to improve this year, then talk about him as only a bat. A lot of young players depend on their innate gifts in the minors and learn to be better (defenders) as major leaguers. I think that Arcia has the tools to be average or better, but he has to work at it.

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  10. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by johnnydakota View Post
    If Hicks can hit .260-275 with 10-15 Home runs , how is that not an improvement over any player we had in the outfield last year?
    1. "IF"
    2. His defense was not nearly as good as advertised.
    3. Arcia

  11. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by mike wants wins View Post
    IF Buxton, Hicks and Rosario can all play in the majors, where would you plan to play Arcia, assuming Dozier is playing 2B? It sin't about pigeon holing, not for me.....it is about getting the best players on the field, in their best positions. Arcia will never be the defender any of those three are.
    I assume Rosario still plays 2B. Regardless, I think we are all going to be disappointed if we assume Buxton, Hicks, Rosario and Arcia will all be able to hit enough at the MLB level to create a logjam. In my opinion, after Buxton, Arcia is the most likely to be a dependable bat. There will likely be room for him in the OF simply because other prospects won't pan out.

  12. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blackjack View Post
    Good defense and good pitching at least will keep you in games. Until a 30 HR guy that plays good defense comes along, Hicks will work.
    Work? with what? He allows too many balls to drop in front of him to claim he is a "plus defender". And then there's his BAVG--ugh. From my perspective, this had better be a big turnaround season for Hicks or else it will be time to move him to another franchise. The Twins OF pipeline in the minors is loaded with prospects. These guys can't be held back to give extra chances for Hicks--he must produce or else he should be traded for whatever can be had.

  13. #50
    Twins News Team All-Star TheLeviathan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nicksaviking View Post
    I assume Rosario still plays 2B. Regardless, I think we are all going to be disappointed if we assume Buxton, Hicks, Rosario and Arcia will all be able to hit enough at the MLB level to create a logjam. In my opinion, after Buxton, Arcia is the most likely to be a dependable bat. There will likely be room for him in the OF simply because other prospects won't pan out.
    You may be right that all four won't make it, but there is also Kepler in the system as well. Arcia showed, to me, a skill set that is best going to be adequate in the OF. And that's fine, if we end up having to play him there adequate or even below that isn't going to kill us.

    However, he also projects the be the clear-cut fourth outfielder of the group defensively. As Doc said, DHing does take a different kind of mental approach. If it's something Arcia is going to be doing full time or even regularly - I'd like to see him start to get that going in the next two years. Keeping Willingham around just muddies the team's options.

  14. #51
    Owner All-Star John Bonnes's Avatar
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    It's nice that he likes it here. If some guys fail to develop, that might make sense.

  15. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by stringer bell View Post
    It is interesting that so many think of Hicks' defense as elite. IMHO it wasn't even average last year. He displayed the tools to be very good, but he had a bunch of bad jumps and misplays, especially early in the season. On the Arcia discussion, if he fails to improve this year, then talk about him as only a bat. A lot of young players depend on their innate gifts in the minors and learn to be better (defenders) as major leaguers. I think that Arcia has the tools to be average or better, but he has to work at it.
    Not being a sabr literate person , all I got is the ole Ryan eye test, he is better defensivly then Ham , Arcia, Kubel and any catcher we ran out there ,last season, and If we get the production i said , Arcia and Ham will have to put up big numbers to off set what Hicks brings defensivly...But he needs to hit or its moot.....To me we aint going to be printing world series tickets in 2014 , so lets finally find out what we got , contenders or pretenders....

  16. #53
    Senior Member All-Star cmathewson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kwak View Post
    Work? with what? He allows too many balls to drop in front of him to claim he is a "plus defender". And then there's his BAVG--ugh. From my perspective, this had better be a big turnaround season for Hicks or else it will be time to move him to another franchise. The Twins OF pipeline in the minors is loaded with prospects. These guys can't be held back to give extra chances for Hicks--he must produce or else he should be traded for whatever can be had.
    When a lot of people think of Hicks, they remember his first 14 days, which were equally bad at the plate and in the field. After the turnaround, he was equally good at the plate and in the field. Which was not elite, but was as good or better than Ben Revere. That said, he has work to do. But you don't give up on the guy with the second best toolset in the organization because he started bad.
    "If you'da been thinkin' you wouldn't 'a thought that.."

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  18. #54
    Quote Originally Posted by Marta Shearing View Post
    Yep, there is no reason to keep willingham around. Rosario in LF is the only way to go unless dozier falls flat on his face. Arcia has DH written all over him. And Buxton and Hicks will cover a ton of ground out there, and I love Hicks arm im RF.
    Totally agree. Absolutely ZERO reasons to keep Willingham--no matter where he wants to finish his career. By 2015, Sano and Buxton will be up. Hopefully Hicks and Arcia can develop. That means Willingham has no spot. For that matter unless they do something this year--Plouffe (future RF/DH??) and Parmalee will not have spots either. Trade Willingham ASAP for what you can get. Maybe also Plouffe or Parms.

  19. #55
    Senior Member All-Star cmathewson's Avatar
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    I agree with the posters who suggested the best case for Willingham: He mashes enough to raise his trade stock, whereupon we trade him at the end of July to make room for Sano, moving Plouffe tot he outfield in the process.
    "If you'da been thinkin' you wouldn't 'a thought that.."

  20. #56
    Twins News Team All-Star TheLeviathan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cmathewson View Post
    When a lot of people think of Hicks, they remember his first 14 days, which were equally bad at the plate and in the field. After the turnaround, he was equally good at the plate and in the field. Which was not elite, but was as good or better than Ben Revere. That said, he has work to do. But you don't give up on the guy with the second best toolset in the organization because he started bad.
    I'm sorry, but Hicks was not as good or better than Revere in the field last year. I'm not sure how you came to that conclusion.

    That's not dismissing his future, just stating plainly how underwhelming he was.

  21. #57
    I cannot imagine the Twins extending him. It is all down hill from here given his age and recent injuries. There is always a need for that veteran bat off the bench, but that is a luxury a contending team enjoys. Besides if he is extended what prospect is being held back as a result?

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  23. #58
    Twins Moderator MVP ashburyjohn's Avatar
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    Update to the article from MLBTR:

    Willingham himself confirmed his desire to remain with the Twins to Berardino today...Willingham went on to say that he "would never" approach a front office about an extension...
    Correct. That is what agents are for.
    Last edited by ashburyjohn; 02-19-2014 at 12:45 PM.

  24. #59
    Senior Member All-Star cmathewson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheLeviathan View Post
    I'm sorry, but Hicks was not as good or better than Revere in the field last year. I'm not sure how you came to that conclusion.

    That's not dismissing his future, just stating plainly how underwhelming he was.
    UZR was similar. Hicks had many more outfield assists.
    "If you'da been thinkin' you wouldn't 'a thought that.."

  25. #60
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    Yesterday Gardy said he really like Hicks, couldn't send him down earlier because they had no one to replace him. Gene Glynn raved about Hicks and said he'll be a star. I tend to agree Hicks will be a good one for a long time.

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