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Thread: Article: Samuel Deduno and Strange Decisions

  1. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by cmathewson View Post
    I don't think any of those guys will continue to suck. But can we dispense with the talk about zero risk for signing free agents?
    Wow. I would really love to see a single post anywhere in the history of this website that said free agents carried "zero risk." Inexplicable comment.

    I'm not a huge Deduno fan. He's a fine 6th starter since pretty much every team needs a 6th starter, and often a 7th, and 8th, etc. The problem is the lack of a #1 starter, #2 starter...

  2. #42
    Twins Moderator MVP USAFChief's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cmathewson View Post
    By the way, when people say there is no downside to signing people to big contracts for multiple years, they rarely have these situations in mind. They say, "you can always trade them." I was all for trading Correia in the offseason. So were the Twins, according to rumors. No takers, despite the horrible state of pitching in baseball. If he doesn't improve, you eat his $5 million. Ditto for Pelfrey ($11 Million). Ditto for Hughes ($22 Million). Ditto for Nolasco ($44 million). (I might have my figures a bit off, but I like the progression.)

    I don't think any of those guys will continue to suck. But can we dispense with the talk about zero risk for signing free agents?
    Has there been such talk?
    Every post is not every other post. - a wise man

  3. #43
    Twins News Team All-Star TheLeviathan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cmathewson View Post
    don't think any of those guys will continue to suck. But can we dispense with the talk about zero risk for signing free agents?
    Their signings were still an overwhelming positive for this franchise.

    The problem is people became convinced they represented 100% odds of improving the team. Which was far from a foregone conclusion. (And the opposite, 10 games in, is also far from such a conclusion)

  4. #44
    Senior Member All-Star Sconnie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by drivlikejehu View Post
    Wow. I would really love to see a single post anywhere in the history of this website that said free agents carried "zero risk." Inexplicable comment.

    I'm not a huge Deduno fan. He's a fine 6th starter since pretty much every team needs a 6th starter, and often a 7th, and 8th, etc. The problem is the lack of a #1 starter, #2 starter...
    My recollection follows with CMat, there has been a lot of call for "sign free agents, what do you have to lose, it's only money," types of arguments here at TD and at other Twins boards.... but every team, even the Yankees and a Dodgers need to sign quality free agents to risk-adequate contracts. It has yet to be seen if the pitchers signed this offseason are quality contracts.

    Deduno has been relatively successful compared to the rest of the rotation, but his control is terrible, and in turn his innings per game are low like a mop up reliever anyways. I recall Perkins being quoted as saying something to the effect of it took him a while to learn how to be a relief pitcher. Once he put his mind to being a relief pitcher, then he sought coaching, and the rest is history. I think Deduno could benefit a lot from reducing his pitch selection to 2, and focusing on getting those two right for 3 outs. Give him time to figure out his new role. Maybe we'll see him in higher leverage situations come August.

    Bartlett (and Kubel at ST break) was a mystery to me, just like having 13 pitches and 3 catchers on this roster baffles me now. I get the extra reliever since the starters can't get thru the 5th, but good golly couldn't you send down Hermann to get your thirteenth pitcher? Or is Hermann now the super utility guy? Are we going to see Hermann taking fielding practice at SS? I don't see how a team can break ST without someone capable defensively to back up CF, and it wasn't fair to Bartlett, the team, or the fans, to shoehorn him into a role he was destined to fail.

    yes I'm aware that I just said, give Deduno time to figure out his new role, but Bartlett is already a failure at his new role. I think it's less of a stretch for a 30 year old somewhat successful pitcher to change his approach at the rubber, than it is for a 35 year old who didn't play ball in any capacity for the last season and a half to learn how to track slicing line drives.

  5. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheLeviathan View Post
    Their signings were still an overwhelming positive for this franchise.

    The problem is people became convinced they represented 100% odds of improving the team. Which was far from a foregone conclusion. (And the opposite, 10 games in, is also far from such a conclusion)
    Odds of improving over the likes of DeVries, Walters, Albers, Hendriks, Hernandez? OK, maybe only 99.99% chance of an improvement over that crew.

  6. #46
    Senior Member All-Star Badsmerf's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nick Nelson View Post
    Based on what, exactly? He's had almost nothing but success since coming over to this organization.
    I'm just not a believer in a guy that can't throw strikes, doesn't have velocity, and doesn't strike people out. He had a 35% LD against, yet only a .293 babip. Stupid luck right there. I don't have faith in guys like that. You can talk about stuff all you want, but that only takes a pitcher so far.

    P.S. I hope this post is better and I don't offend anyone.
    Do or do not. There is no try.

  7. #47
    Twins News Team All-Star TheLeviathan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jokin View Post
    Odds of improving over the likes of DeVries, Walters, Albers, Hendriks, Hernandez? OK, maybe only 99.99% chance of an improvement over that crew.
    And yet here we are so far. 10 games in and we need a 13th pitcher in the bullpen due to starter ineffectiveness. Long way to go, but it just goes to show each of these guys had major question marks.

  8. #48
    Senior Member Big-Leaguer
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    I noticed a lot of posters are getting angry at the signings we made just over the winter. Seems a bit early. If Hughes develops into a sold number 3 starter then we got him for almost half off market value. Nolasco will be solid by the end of the season. I am glad Gibson is up and starting. I am indifferent on Corriea and Pelfry though I would like to give Pelfry a chance. Also 3.5 million of Pelfry's 11 million is incentives if I remember correctly. Deduno and Meyer are the 6th and 7th starters so to speak so that is good too. I would think that if Deduno is starting he would be on an innings limit of around 140 or so anyway due to not pitching that many in years if ever. I like how our pitching staff is currently set up and have no problems with it. We have options moving forward there.

    The big issue I have for this season is the injuries to both Sano and Buxton as I was expecting them to come up at some point this season and provide the team with support so Plouffe could play RF or LF if Willingham gets traded or moves to DH or if Arcia goes to the minors and Buxton could move Hicks to either RF,LF or bench. but instead they are hurt and so is both Willingham and Arcia so we have no replacements that fit as starters exactly. Bartlett on the roster didn't bother me because I don't think he is meant to get much time in the OF mostly just backing up CF so Hicks can get some rest. If you as a fan are upset about Bartlett playing LF in that game where the other OF was the DH, just wait till we play a game without the 3rd catcher while the back up C DH's...

    This is a season of transition and there is potential on this team to surprise. but it is deflating when all of the transition part of the offense is injured.
    Last edited by Brandon; 04-12-2014 at 11:20 AM.

  9. #49
    Senior Member All-Star Shane Wahl's Avatar
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    It's really early in the year so I am not that worried about Nolasco and Hughes. Has anyone looked into how the Twins starters compare to the rest of the league in giving up runs in the 1st inning over the past 4 seasons now? Something seems really amiss with preparation and whatnot, whether it be Nolasco, Hughes, Correia, Pelfrey or Blackburn, Liriano, Marquis or Hendriks, Walters, and Gibson 2013.

    Are we really going to simply blame the pitchers?

    Anyway, I am not worrying about Nolasco and Hughes (though I worry about the extra year in both their contracts), but Correia and Pelfrey, obviously, is another story. Meyer is of course going to have a Gibsonesque innings limit (and the Twins will likely screw that up again too) and the more veteran guys they brought in are rather meh. Pray for May (the pitcher, not the month) to at least become a 4th starter this year!

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