Minnesota Twins News & Rumors Forum
Page 3 of 3 FirstFirst 123
Results 41 to 57 of 57

Thread: Danny Santana

  1. #41
    Senior Member All-Star
    Posts
    1,165
    Like
    103
    Liked 278 Times in 201 Posts
    Blog Entries
    5
    Quote Originally Posted by Brock Beauchamp View Post
    Agreed. The likelihood of Plouffe becoming an acceptable long-term 3B is much higher than Escobar doing the same.
    Not to mention, Plouffe's .706 OPS is 12th in the major leagues. It is almost as if we had Mike Schmidt at 3B for 20 years and he just retired and we have unrealistic expectations for the next guy. Rather, Plouffe replaced the likes of Mike Lamb, Tony Bautista, Nick Punto, etc.

    http://mlb.mlb.com/stats/sortable.js...on='5'

  2. #42
    Owner MVP Brock Beauchamp's Avatar
    Posts
    8,134
    Twitter
    @rocketpig76
    Like
    49
    Liked 1,607 Times in 834 Posts
    Blog Entries
    6
    Quote Originally Posted by tobi0040 View Post
    Not to mention, Plouffe's .706 OPS is 12th in the major leagues. It is almost as if we had Mike Schmidt at 3B for 20 years and he just retired and we have unrealistic expectations for the next guy. Rather, Plouffe replaced the likes of Mike Lamb, Tony Bautista, Nick Punto, etc.

    http://mlb.mlb.com/stats/sortable.js...on='5'
    Yep. For all the condemnation of Plouffe, he's always flirting with league average numbers. Sometimes a little over (2012), sometimes a little under (2013). Thus far in 2014, he's right around league average.

  3. This user likes Brock Beauchamp's post and wants to buy him/her a steak dinner:

    tobi0040 (05-12-2014)

  4. #43
    Twins Moderator MVP USAFChief's Avatar
    Posts
    6,621
    Like
    3,697
    Liked 3,186 Times in 1,364 Posts
    I think expectations for Santana are out of whack with his career .711 minor league OPS.
    Every post is not every other post. - a wise man

  5. These 2 users like USAFChief's post and want to buy him/her a steak dinner:

    Cris E (05-14-2014), mike wants wins (05-12-2014)

  6. #44
    Senior Member All-Star
    Posts
    1,165
    Like
    103
    Liked 278 Times in 201 Posts
    Blog Entries
    5
    Quote Originally Posted by USAFChief View Post
    I think expectations for Santana are out of whack with his career .711 minor league OPS.
    That could be, but .711 would rank 14th among SS so far this year. Consider a few things:

    -Santana has been younger than every league he has been in
    -He has averaged close to 20 doubles a year
    -His SB totals from 2011 to 2013 were 24, 17, and 30
    -What are the other options?


    Lets let this kid learn up here and put up better numbers doing it than the alternative.


    http://mlb.mlb.com/stats/sortable.js...on='6'

    http://www.baseball-reference.com/mi...d=santan001dan
    Last edited by tobi0040; 05-12-2014 at 12:04 PM.

  7. #45
    Senior Member All-Star
    Posts
    1,165
    Like
    103
    Liked 278 Times in 201 Posts
    Blog Entries
    5
    Quote Originally Posted by Brock Beauchamp View Post
    Yep. For all the condemnation of Plouffe, he's always flirting with league average numbers. Sometimes a little over (2012), sometimes a little under (2013). Thus far in 2014, he's right around league average.
    I am a big fan of Plouffe. He doesn't make much money. He is league average right now and if Sano pushes him off 3B he may be able to move to a corner OF spot, and at the very least be a bench/platoon option elsewhere against lefties (career .826 OPS)*

    *Assumes the Twins change course and adopt a platooning strategy

  8. #46
    Senior Member Triple-A
    Posts
    343
    Like
    124
    Liked 27 Times in 21 Posts
    Blog Entries
    4
    At the moment playing Santana at SS, Escobar at 3B, and Plouffe in a corner OF doesn't seem all that unreasonable. That's not intended to be permanent, eventually the roster gets shaken up by Arcia/Willingham coming back and one/both of Escoabar and Santana cooling off to a more realistic level. Until then, might as well get your hottest hitters (not sure Plouffe right now qualifies, but the competition is Kubel and Colabello) on the field in the most optimal arrangement possible.

  9. #47
    Senior Member All-Star cmathewson's Avatar
    Posts
    2,273
    Like
    241
    Liked 464 Times in 291 Posts
    Blog Entries
    1
    I was going to post what Tobi posted. Raw OPS is not the only measure of tools. He has tools unlike any in the organization at his position. As long as he's producing, this is valuable learning time. If he struggles in a Hicksian fashion, he could benefit from more seasoning. Until then, watch and enjoy.
    Last edited by cmathewson; 05-12-2014 at 04:25 PM.
    "If you'da been thinkin' you wouldn't 'a thought that.."

  10. This user likes cmathewson's post and wants to buy him/her a steak dinner:

    mike wants wins (05-12-2014)

  11. #48
    Senior Member Triple-A
    Posts
    245
    Like
    0
    Liked 51 Times in 26 Posts
    Since he has a chance to solve a huge problem for us, Santana should be playing SS exclusively, whether it is here or Rochester. Why anybody (including Gardy) would think it is a good idea to start asking him to play multiple positions when he is still trying to master the one most important to us is beyond me. Run Esco out there if you feel the need to continue this boneheaded experiment. This is classic Gardy: a couple years ago he would have cut off his own hand before he would put an infielder in the outfield. Now he thinks half the guys on the roster are Ben Zobrist. Where did the "defense is more important than anything" manager go?

  12. #49
    Senior Member Big-Leaguer
    Posts
    740
    Like
    56
    Liked 122 Times in 77 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by Brock Beauchamp View Post
    Agreed. The likelihood of Plouffe becoming an acceptable long-term 3B is much higher than Escobar doing the same.
    I highly doubt either one will become an acceptable long-term 3b.

  13. #50
    Owner MVP Brock Beauchamp's Avatar
    Posts
    8,134
    Twitter
    @rocketpig76
    Like
    49
    Liked 1,607 Times in 834 Posts
    Blog Entries
    6
    Quote Originally Posted by Halsey Hall View Post
    I highly doubt either one will become an acceptable long-term 3b.
    Plouffe has looked a lot better this season and is posting a positive WAR defensively and offensively. I doubt he'll ever be great but he's a decent enough player to stick at third through his prime seasons.

  14. These 2 users like Brock Beauchamp's post and want to buy him/her a steak dinner:

    cmathewson (05-12-2014), mike wants wins (05-12-2014)

  15. #51
    Senior Member Double-A
    Posts
    133
    Like
    4
    Liked 10 Times in 7 Posts
    Sunday's game blew my little mind, to quote an old Donovan song. As Nick Nelson tweeted, the Rochester Red Wings infield was playing outfield for the Twins by the end of the game. Nunez in left, Santana in CF, Parmalee in right. And you know what? They looked pretty damned good doing it. Nunez made a running catch of a foul ball down the LF line like he'd been doing it forever. Santana called everybody off to take that blooper.

    I never want to see Escobar in the OF again, and I do not want to see Santana playing SS until he actually develops, you know, SS skill. Don't you guys remember Santana throwing the ball to Dozier for a failed force play instead of making the easy out at first, in the Saturday game? That would have been the third out of the inning, and we might have won that game. Santana at shortstop = dumb move. Santana at CF = fast enough to play CF, so let him start until Hicks finds his bat.

  16. #52
    Owner MVP Brock Beauchamp's Avatar
    Posts
    8,134
    Twitter
    @rocketpig76
    Like
    49
    Liked 1,607 Times in 834 Posts
    Blog Entries
    6
    Quote Originally Posted by Dave T View Post
    I never want to see Escobar in the OF again, and I do not want to see Santana playing SS until he actually develops, you know, SS skill. Don't you guys remember Santana throwing the ball to Dozier for a failed force play instead of making the easy out at first, in the Saturday game? That would have been the third out of the inning, and we might have won that game. Santana at shortstop = dumb move. Santana at CF = fast enough to play CF, so let him start until Hicks finds his bat.
    You're putting an awful lot of stock in three innings that resulted in three put-outs.

  17. #53
    Senior Member All-Star
    Posts
    1,689
    Like
    3
    Liked 337 Times in 214 Posts
    Blog Entries
    1
    Quote Originally Posted by tobi0040 View Post
    I am a big fan of Plouffe. He doesn't make much money. He is league average right now and if Sano pushes him off 3B he may be able to move to a corner OF spot, and at the very least be a bench/platoon option elsewhere against lefties (career .826 OPS)*

    *Assumes the Twins change course and adopt a platooning strategy
    Agreed, although he is becoming less cheap every year. He's making $2.35 million this year, and for his ~.700 OPS production, he may not be worth a raise beyond that, particularly if he's a corner OF or utility guy.

    Ideally he could still bridge us to Sano in 2015, but it might be best to deal him (or even non-tender him?) before then too, depending on Sano's rehab.

  18. #54
    Senior Member MVP
    Posts
    5,721
    Like
    1,159
    Liked 568 Times in 372 Posts
    Or put him in LF if he can.
    Lighten up Francis....

  19. #55
    Senior Member All-Star
    Posts
    1,165
    Like
    103
    Liked 278 Times in 201 Posts
    Blog Entries
    5
    Quote Originally Posted by spycake View Post
    Agreed, although he is becoming less cheap every year. He's making $2.35 million this year, and for his ~.700 OPS production, he may not be worth a raise beyond that, particularly if he's a corner OF or utility guy.

    Ideally he could still bridge us to Sano in 2015, but it might be best to deal him (or even non-tender him?) before then too, depending on Sano's rehab.
    You lost me at non-tender. Even if he is making $3M a year. He can hit in five positions (3B, 1B, LF, RF, DH) and crushes lefties. If we are lucky enough to have a better hitter at 3B, 1B, DH, LF, and RF and nobody at those spots is hurt, he is a bench alternative to the likes of one of our 3 SS, Parmelee, Hermann, our 3rd catcher, etc.

    If Sano comes up and sticks at 3B, of course you gauge his value as 3B is a weak position in the league. But the alternative is a great platoon player, not a non-tender.

  20. These 2 users like tobi0040's post and want to buy him/her a steak dinner:

    cmathewson (05-12-2014), mike wants wins (05-12-2014)

  21. #56
    Senior Member All-Star cmathewson's Avatar
    Posts
    2,273
    Like
    241
    Liked 464 Times in 291 Posts
    Blog Entries
    1
    I don't know how Plouffe got added to a Santana thread, but since it went that way...

    People need to keep in mind that he is hitting with virtually no protection. When Colabello and Kubel were hot, Plouffe got some pitches to hit. Since Cola and Kubel became out machines, he's lucky to get one hitter's pitch per plate appearance. He's not missing them by much, but he is missing them. Let's see him with real hitters behind him before we jump to the conclusion that he isn't any good.

    MY POV: He'll never be an All Star. But he can be a decent bridge to Sano. Even after Sano, I can see him with a role on this team, either in LF or RF, or as a DH platoon and super utility guy. The only way he gets too expensive is if he finishes a season with a sustained period like his 2012 before the wrist injury. If that happens, he'll be a valuable trade chip.
    "If you'da been thinkin' you wouldn't 'a thought that.."

  22. #57
    Senior Member All-Star
    Posts
    1,165
    Like
    103
    Liked 278 Times in 201 Posts
    Blog Entries
    5
    Quote Originally Posted by cmathewson View Post
    I don't know how Plouffe got added to a Santana thread, but since it went that way...

    Even after Sano, I can see him with a role on this team, either in LF or RF, or as a DH platoon and super utility guy. The only way he gets too expensive is if he finishes a season with a sustained period like his 2012 before the wrist injury. If that happens, he'll be a valuable trade chip.
    I agree. Championship caliber teams have guys like this on them. He is not a #3 or #4 hitter on a championship team. But he is a guy that can come up with an OPS over .800 in the 40 games you play against a lefty. Mauer and Arcia have a history of being banged up and going on the DL, having Plouffe around to step in is huge. These things win games over the course of a year.

Page 3 of 3 FirstFirst 123

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
©2014 TwinsCentric, LLC. All Rights Reserved.
Interested in advertising with Twins Daily? Click here.