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Thread: Pierzynski DFA'd (Rosenthal Rumor)

  1. #61
    Twins News Team All-Star TheLeviathan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SpiritofVodkaDave View Post
    Oh boy here we go, down the Kevin Slowey rabbit hole again!

    The Twins had the AUDACITY! to criticize Slowey when he refused to goto the bullpen.
    Yeah, what a jerk for looking out for his career and livelihood. Definitely deserved a public lynching for that.

    So yeah, let's not go down that rabbit hole and just accept the Twins have some notable people that do go out and do this with players. As do other teams as well, it's just not a relevant comparison in this case because no one from the Red Sox org. is doing it.

  2. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheLeviathan View Post
    Yeah, what a jerk for looking out for his career and livelihood. Definitely deserved a public lynching for that.

    So yeah, let's not go down that rabbit hole and just accept the Twins have some notable people that do go out and do this with players. As do other teams as well, it's just not a relevant comparison in this case because no one from the Red Sox org. is doing it.
    Outside of Slowey, who are these other players the Twins have been bashing on their way out?

  3. #63
    Twins News Team All-Star TheLeviathan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gunnarthor View Post
    Outside of Slowey, who are these other players the Twins have been bashing on their way out?
    I'll have to think about it a bit, the hard part is proving it of course. Most of it is anecdotal and more based on memory, so it could certainly be wrong. I feel like Baker belongs in that group but after that it's sketchy.

    (Note, I'm not making that argument per se.....just defending the position that this particular case doesn't match gripes we hear)

  4. #64
    Senior Member Triple-A
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    I will preface this by saying I really don't have much respect for AJ so maybe my view is just too tainted to be fair. Doesn't the fact that he got DFA'd before the All Star break and before the trade deadline speak volumes about him as a clubhouse presence? I mean there is a market for catchers at the deadline and the Sox couldn't wait until then to get the greatest value for him? You have got to be in a bad spot with a player to do that in IMO.

    AJ as a team unifier has never been his role. His role is better suited as team villain or at the very least an uncouth personality. For those who think his is the kind of personality that provides a spark for his team mates maybe this latest example shows how unlikely that is.

    For those that love him maybe I am wrong and this is just AJ being AJ but this is the second time a team couldn't live with him for even a year. That says a lot in my opinion.

  5. #65
    Senior Member All-Star SpiritofVodkaDave's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheLeviathan View Post
    Yeah, what a jerk for looking out for his career and livelihood. Definitely deserved a public lynching for that.

    So yeah, let's not go down that rabbit hole and just accept the Twins have some notable people that do go out and do this with players. As do other teams as well, it's just not a relevant comparison in this case because no one from the Red Sox org. is doing it.
    So by REFUSING a job from the company that was paying him quite handsomly he was looking out for his career and livelihood? How does that make sense?

    Nothing screams "I deserve to start period" then going 0-8 in 8 starts with a 7.25 ERA.

    Instead of saying that the Twins were unfairly bashing him, maybe the more reasonable assumption is that Kevin Slowey was in fact kind of a jerk and deserved whatever bashing (I use that word very liberally because I still don't think they bashed him) came upon him?
    "You miss 100% of the shots you don't take"- L. Harvey Oswald


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  7. #66
    Twins News Team All-Star TheLeviathan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SpiritofVodkaDave View Post
    So by REFUSING a job from the company that was paying him quite handsomly he was looking out for his career and livelihood? How does that make sense?
    He thought moving to the bullpen would be bad for his arm....and he subsequently got hurt. So not only was he looking out for his career, he was demonstrably right and the team wrong in the handling.

    (Also, your zeal to defend the team on this issue completely ignores the fact that they "converted" him a week before the season and then proceeded to use him in 3 out of 4 games as a setup man. Hurt or not that was incredibly risky. Maybe the guy just knew his arm and knew he was being misused.)

  8. #67
    Senior Member All-Star SpiritofVodkaDave's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheLeviathan View Post
    Maybe the guy just knew his arm and knew he was being misused.)
    Occam's razor tells us that he was probably just a bad pitcher with a bad attitude.
    "You miss 100% of the shots you don't take"- L. Harvey Oswald


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  10. #68
    Twins News Team All-Star TheLeviathan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SpiritofVodkaDave View Post
    Occam's razor tells us that he was probably just a bad pitcher with a bad attitude.
    Yup, probably was. And his two greatest crimes were admitting arm soreness (something we are now bashing Nolasco in the reverse as fans) and not liking his conversion. A process I would say most of us would not like repeated in taking a starter and turning him into a reliever.

  11. #69
    Senior Member All-Star SpiritofVodkaDave's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheLeviathan View Post
    Yup, probably was. And his two greatest crimes were admitting arm soreness (something we are now bashing Nolasco in the reverse as fans) and not liking his conversion. A process I would say most of us would not like repeated in taking a starter and turning him into a reliever.
    Perkins was able to have the humility to handle it, and what did he get out of it?
    $$$$$ and a couple all star appearances as one of the premiere closers in the league.

    Slowey unfortunately choose the road less traveled by and is now just another AAAA pitcher who will likely be out of the league within 12 months.
    "You miss 100% of the shots you don't take"- L. Harvey Oswald


  12. #70
    Twins News Team All-Star TheLeviathan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SpiritofVodkaDave View Post
    Perkins was able to have the humility to handle it
    Jesus Dave, at one point we all called him Crocodile Tears. He didn't exactly fall on his sword. Nor was the transition smooth.

    For the record, I didn't like how we converted Perkins either. I don't think it's a particularly wise way of doing things.

  13. #71
    Quote Originally Posted by gunnarthor View Post
    Red Sox: 1.587 billion in payroll last 10 years
    Twins: 845 million in payroll last 10 years.

    Almost seems like a significant resource advantage should be considered, no? I mean, that extra 700m+ had to be worth at least one win.
    We can't have it both ways. When the Twins don't sign someone, the Pohlads are called cheap seven ways from Sunday. Then, when other teams that spend more have more success, fans bemoan the apparent resource disadvantage. Further, several teams have demonstrated that total salary is of less importance than collecting the right players and having a strategy that identifies skills that are cheaper than the market values them, e.g., compare the success and payroll of the 2014 Oakland A's to the success and payroll of the 2011 and 2012 Minnesota Twins. In this era, management decision-making is of more value than ever, and perhaps has more impact on success than does total spend. The Red Sox have shown more willingness to recognize what works and what doesn't, and to quickly change when things aren't working.
    "Where's the Crede?"

  14. #72
    Quote Originally Posted by Hosken Bombo Disco View Post
    I mean, what was A. J. doing on his smartphone after a game? Probably betting on other baseball games I bet..
    He was looking up helpful quotations from Dr. Leo Buscaglia.
    "Where's the Crede?"

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  16. #73
    Quote Originally Posted by USAFChief View Post
    The original point you made was that the Twins "rarely if ever bashed a player when they leave."

    I don't think that's true. In fact, I think it's just the opposite...I feel you can often tell when a player has run out of chances with the Twins a couple weeks before they leave. The broadcast crew goes from "say/see/hear no evil" to attack mode overnight. I doubt that's coincidence.
    The Sox waited until A.J. left before bashing him, if we give credence to the article by a radio talk d.j. who quoted anonymous sources. In fact, it has been suggested that the Sox waited until he left to voice their dislike. The Twins, on the other hand, frequently let public criticism escape about players still in the system, particularly if they are young and/or several years away from free agency, e.g., Baker, Neshek, Slowey, Perkins, Lohse, Garza, Bartlett (first time around, before he became a good clubhouse presence without health or skills), Hardy (a little), Colabello, Hicks, Pinto and probably others. Sano got a little taste of it last year. Even when Mauer was young, Gardy would comment publicly about mistakes he made.

    It would be unlike employees in nearly every other company if the broadcast team didn't know or figure out what their bosses were thinking and shape their commentary accordingly.
    "Where's the Crede?"

  17. #74
    Senior Member All-Star
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    Quote Originally Posted by Deduno Abides View Post
    The Twins, on the other hand, frequently let public criticism escape about players still in the system, particularly if they are young and/or several years away from free agency, e.g., Baker, Neshek, Slowey, Perkins, Lohse, Garza, Bartlett (first time around, before he became a good clubhouse presence without health or skills), Hardy (a little), Colabello, Hicks, Pinto and probably others. Sano got a little taste of it last year. Even when Mauer was young, Gardy would comment publicly about mistakes he made.
    OK. If we equate "he needs to work on X" to bashing, I suppose you're right. I think most of us thought of bashing meant something akin to "he's all screwed up b/c of the pain pills he's taking" or "our pitchers are too busy drinking beer and eating chicken to pay attention to baseball". Or, "he took some 7 year old kids shoes in ST, made him cry and his grandma had to get the shoes back from a coach".

    Honestly, I haven't seen the Twins treat players much differently than most organizations. Last year, the Mets manager said something relatively innocent about Wheeler getting smacked around in KC and the critics said he was throwing his rookie under the bus. Nats manager benched Bryce Harper! for not running out a grounder to the pitcher (never saw Gardy do that). Heck, Gardy refused to bench Young after he misplayed a KC out into a 3 run double his first year with us. Ron Washington made CJ Wilson give him the ball "the right way" when he was pulling him from a game. Joe Maddon has told the press that Wil Myers has made mental errors and was struggling.

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  19. #75
    Senior Member Big-Leaguer Kirby_Waved_At_Me's Avatar
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    update: AJ is now a free agent after being released by Boston.

    He has informed his agent that he still wants to play this year, so maybe a team will pick him up. Seattle, Baltimore, St. Louis all could use another catcher, and he certainly would be a better hitter than most of the current back up catchers in the majors.

  20. #76
    Senior Member Triple-A
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kirby_Waved_At_Me View Post
    update: AJ is now a free agent after being released by Boston.

    He has informed his agent that he still wants to play this year, so maybe a team will pick him up. Seattle, Baltimore, St. Louis all could use another catcher, and he certainly would be a better hitter than most of the current back up catchers in the majors.
    Yeah he is talented and a team wouldn't have to give up prospects to get him. Tough thing is will he fit in clubhouse? Boston seems to be doing better without him. Not sure what that says other AJ's rep makes him more of a gamble than most.

  21. #77
    the only people who have problems with aj are management
    and the opposition

  22. #78
    Quote Originally Posted by hawkiconk View Post
    the only people who have problems with aj are management
    and the opposition
    Well, that clearly was not the case in Boston...did you read the story?

  23. #79
    the story
    the horror

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  25. #80
    Senior Member All-Star Sconnie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kirby_Waved_At_Me View Post
    update: AJ is now a free agent after being released by Boston.

    He has informed his agent that he still wants to play this year, so maybe a team will pick him up. Seattle, Baltimore, St. Louis all could use another catcher, and he certainly would be a better hitter than most of the current back up catchers in the majors.
    The Twins should sign him just to preserve the value of trading Suzuki
    "If I knew the world would end tomorrow, I would still plant a tree today."

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