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Thread: Salt, meet wound

  1. #1
    Owner Big-Leaguer Parker Hageman's Avatar
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    Salt, meet wound

    This is beating a dead-horse, I know.

    The Gold Glove Awards were announced last night in an oddly concocted award show format on ESPN2. In the AL, Baltimore Orioles' shortstop JJ Hardy was the recipient of the hardware for that position. So now, the Twins have traded away a 30-home run, Gold Glove winning shortstop.

    Since trading him, the Twins have had a -5.2 UZR/150 at the position (third-worst in the AL) along with a .280 weighted on-base average (third lowest). Meanwhile, the Orioles have hit the most home runs at the position (52 compared to the Twins' 18) and the O's have had the third-highest UZR/150 (9.6) in baseball.

    How do you feel about the team's future at this pivotal position?
    @OverTheBaggy

  2. #2
    Please ban me! All-Star stringer bell's Avatar
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    I find it far more significant that the O's UZR is high than whether or not JJ won the Gold Glove. I actually think he probably deserved it, but the Gold Glove is perhaps the worst award given by MLB. Several marginal defenders have won the award and some (Palmeiro) have won when they mostly have served as a DH.

  3. #3
    Owner Big-Leaguer Parker Hageman's Avatar
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    Right, the Gold Glove is often a travestshamockery and you could argue that Brendon Ryan was a superior defender, but I think this is league-wide recognition that JJ Hardy is very much an elite defender and jives with the advanced defensive statistics.
    @OverTheBaggy

  4. #4
    Senior Member All-Star Winston Smith's Avatar
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    No doubt Gardy is happy he has shortstops that play the way he did and not Hardy.
    This comment brought to you from the Rosedale Mall studio by Hamm's Beer, brewed in the land of sky blue waters.

  5. #5
    Senior Member Big-Leaguer 70charger's Avatar
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    Hindsight is 20/20. I'm sure there were more than a few here (maybe with paper bags over their heads now) who were fine with jettisoning the fragile Hardy for the next big thing from Japan.

    Besides, to reiterate, Gold Gloves are kind of stupid. Mike Trout didn't win one? That pretty much says it all.

  6. #6
    Senior Member Big-Leaguer Boom Boom's Avatar
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    Hardy was a pansy who missed too much time with that little wrist boo-boo he "had". Also he's slow.

    But seriously, I don't think Dozier has the defensive ability to stick at shortstop and I think Florimon is Juan Castro v2. Whoever the Twins shortstop of the future is, I don't think he's on the roster right now.

  7. #7
    Senior Member All-Star
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    Yeah, MI is a bit of blackhole for us but we do have a handful of legit prospects in the pipeline - Rosario, Micheal, Polanco, Santana. I suspect next year we'll have Carroll (who isn't that bad) and a pu-pu platter again.

    I wonder if Span gets traded for a MI and a pitcher.

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    Senior Member Big-Leaguer
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    How did Jeter not win? Rigged!

  9. #9
    Super Moderator All-Star
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    Quote Originally Posted by 70charger View Post
    Hindsight is 20/20. I'm sure there were more than a few here (maybe with paper bags over their heads now) who were fine with jettisoning the fragile Hardy for the next big thing from Japan.Besides, to reiterate, Gold Gloves are kind of stupid. Mike Trout didn't win one? That pretty much says it all.
    Yes, GGs are stupid, why else would Jeter have a collection?That said, this site didn't exist, but I seem to remember very few people thinking that trading Hardy was a good thing over at BYTO... myself included.

  10. #10
    Senior Member Big-Leaguer Twins Twerp's Avatar
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    We need to draft MI and SP only. No more Relief Pitchers, outfielders, or corner outfielders. Maybe a few catchers now and then. The next stud SS for the Twins will be the first in my 25 year lifetime.

  11. #11
    Senior Member All-Star
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    Had the Twins drafted Hardy, he surely would not have ended up as a SS. His size and (lack of) speed would have convinced the Twins he wouldn't have the range for SS long before he would have reached the majors.

    My biggest issue with the Hardy loss lies in the rumors that the Twins and Hardy butted heads on his reluctance to hit to all fields. Willingham and Plouffe showed this year that for right handed hitters, Hardy's philosopy was the correct one at Target Field.

  12. #12
    Senior Member All-Star Badsmerf's Avatar
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    Fail.
    Do or do not. There is no try.

  13. #13
    Super Moderator All-Star twinsnorth49's Avatar
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    What future at MI ?

    The worst part about losing JJ is that we got jack for him.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Winston Smith View Post
    No doubt Gardy is happy he has shortstops that play the way he did and not Hardy.
    nailed it

  15. #15
    Senior Member All-Star Willihammer's Avatar
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    One of the sweetest moments from the Jr interview. John: Hardy scores outstanding in defensive metrics. Jr: He does? Unreal.

  16. #16
    Super Moderator MVP Riverbrian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by twinsnorth49 View Post
    What future at MI ?

    The worst part about losing JJ is that we got jack for him.
    Bingo... It's not the players we have lost and what they could be doing for us now.

    It's what we got in return and what those acquired players are NOT doing for us.

  17. #17
    Owner MVP Seth Stohs's Avatar
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    I didn't have a problem with trading Hardy at the time. I think if they would have received two relievers who were at least decent it wouldn't have been so bad. But getting nothing for him, and then him going and having his one great year last year kind of combined to a perfect storm. I'm surprised he didn't win the Gold Glove last year when he hit better.

  18. #18
    Senior Member All-Star Jim Crikket's Avatar
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    By the time the Twins traded Hardy, they already had signed Nishioka, so it wasn't exactly a surprise. While he hadn't been an All-Star by any means, with the Twins, he certainly was an improvement over what we'd seen at SS prior to his arrival. Nishioka was an entertaining sideshow initially, but even among those of us who didn't see Hardy as being terrific, I think the reaction was more along the lines of, "OK, you think this is an improvement... you'd better be right." Obviously, the Twins weren't right and the fact that the players they got in return bombed just made things worse.

    I'm happy for Hardy that he's been having success and congratulations to the Orioles on getting the best end of this particular trade.
    I opine about the Twins and Kernels regularly at Knuckleballsblog.com while my alter ego, SD Buhr covers the Kernels for MetroSportsReport.com.

    ~You can get anything you want at Alice's Restaurant~

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by twinsnorth49 View Post
    What future at MI ?

    The worst part about losing JJ is that we got jack for him.
    C'mon, who'll ever forget the time Jim Hoey struck that guy out.

    In between walking 3 and hitting two.
    There isn't enough defense on the planet to justify giving 500+ PA to a guy who can barely OPS .600.

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by GCTF View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by twinsnorth49 View Post
    What future at MI ?

    The worst part about losing JJ is that we got jack for him.
    C'mon, who'll ever forget the time Jim Hoey struck that guy out.

    In between walking 3 and hitting two.
    I forgot;-)

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