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Thread: Scott Baker Signs with Chicago Cubs

  1. #141
    Senior Member All-Star Jim Crikket's Avatar
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    Since most FAs sign with the team that offers the most money, in pretty much every case that means that every other team thinks the team that signed the guy "overpaid" and the only way to avoid doing so is to pick over the bones of the leftovers in February. So, sure, Baker got "overpaid" according to the Twins' views and those of every other team besides the Cubs. It's fine that the Twins didn't re-sign him if, in fact, they go on to fill out their rotation with better pitchers. But I don't see them doing that if they're going to refuse to ever "overpay" because if avoiding overpaying is your priority, you won't sign anyone with any talent. And if it turns out that they still have a gaping hole in the middle of their rotation all because they didn't want to overpay Baker or because he wouldn't give them a team-friendly 2014 option, that would just prove to me that Terry Ryan's doing nothing but blowing smoke up our collective butts about how serious he is about improving the rotation.
    I opine about the Twins and Kernels regularly at Knuckleballsblog.com while my alter ego, SD Buhr covers the Kernels for MetroSportsReport.com.

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  2. #142
    Super Moderator MVP Riverbrian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Crikket View Post
    Since most FAs sign with the team that offers the most money, in pretty much every case that means that every other team thinks the team that signed the guy "overpaid" and the only way to avoid doing so is to pick over the bones of the leftovers in February. So, sure, Baker got "overpaid" according to the Twins' views and those of every other team besides the Cubs. It's fine that the Twins didn't re-sign him if, in fact, they go on to fill out their rotation with better pitchers. But I don't see them doing that if they're going to refuse to ever "overpay" because if avoiding overpaying is your priority, you won't sign anyone with any talent. And if it turns out that they still have a gaping hole in the middle of their rotation all because they didn't want to overpay Baker or because he wouldn't give them a team-friendly 2014 option, that would just prove to me that Terry Ryan's doing nothing but blowing smoke up our collective butts about how serious he is about improving the rotation.
    Nice Post Jim... I Agree completely... I'm hoping that TR will be willing to overpay for someone else. I'm ok with it not being Baker. Jeez... The Off Season Moves slow when you are waiting for something positive.

  3. #143
    The King In The North All-Star Nick Nelson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheLeviathan View Post
    And before you half-cock your snippy response again, check the offseason blueprints as a starter.
    You seem confused. The blueprints are perspectives on what the Twins should do, not predictions of what they will do. Yes, a lot of people believe the Twins should take advantage of this robust pitching market and spend some money to improve on their extraordinary weakness in that department.

    I don't think many folks around here have ridiculous illusions about what pitchers are going to sign for this winter. The fact that Baker got a couple extra million more than we expected from a team that clearly valued him highly doesn't really have any bearing on what guys like Jackson, Marcum and Dempster will get. If the Twins are serious about keeping payroll steady, they could afford a guy like that and then some, but of course what they will do is another story. Again, I think you're mixing up people's wishes with their expectations.

  4. #144
    Senior Member All-Star TheLeviathan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nick Nelson View Post
    I don't think many folks around here have ridiculous illusions about what pitchers are going to sign for this winter. The fact that Baker got a couple extra million more than we expected from a team that clearly valued him highly doesn't really have any bearing on what guys like Jackson, Marcum and Dempster will get. If the Twins are serious about keeping payroll steady, they could afford a guy like that and then some, but of course what they will do is another story. Again, I think you're mixing up people's wishes with their expectations.
    So, basically you're saying the forum has been without substantive analysis for the last month or more and should be seen as nothing more than a series of 6 year old-esque Santa wishlists that shouldn't be taken seriously?

    In that case, we're in total agreement - thank you for making my initial point about how ridiculous those hopes were.

  5. #145
    Senior Member All-Star PseudoSABR's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheLeviathan View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Nick Nelson View Post
    I don't think many folks around here have ridiculous illusions about what pitchers are going to sign for this winter. The fact that Baker got a couple extra million more than we expected from a team that clearly valued him highly doesn't really have any bearing on what guys like Jackson, Marcum and Dempster will get. If the Twins are serious about keeping payroll steady, they could afford a guy like that and then some, but of course what they will do is another story. Again, I think you're mixing up people's wishes with their expectations.
    So, basically you're saying the forum has been without substantive analysis for the last month or more and should be seen as nothing more than a series of 6 year old-esque Santa wishlists that shouldn't be taken seriously?

    In that case, we're in total agreement - thank you for making my initial point about how ridiculous those hopes were.
    This post is excessively douchey, even for you.

  6. #146
    Senior Member All-Star TheLeviathan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PseudoSABR View Post
    This post is excessively douchey, even for you.
    Absolutely intentional. It takes a lot of smug to pass Nick.

    That said, goes back to my point - all the predictions were ridiculous wishlists - not realistic.

    Just to recap: I suggest the offseason "rebuild to contend" posts were ridiculous and insane because they were unrealistic and wishful, get called out for being too harsh and that most people didn't think that, post just a small sample of a much richer pile of evidence to prove that plenty of people did, then get told all of those things were unrealistic and wishful. Right where I started.
    Last edited by TheLeviathan; 11-14-2012 at 08:28 PM.

  7. #147
    Super Moderator MVP USAFChief's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PseudoSABR View Post
    This post is excessively douchey, even for you.
    Oh, I don't know. Average-ish in it's douch-ness, I'd say.

  8. #148
    Speediest Moderator All-Star snepp's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by USAFChief View Post
    Oh, I don't know. Average-ish in it's douch-ness, I'd say.
    What would you say its DORP is?
    "Maybe you could go grab a bat and ball… and learn something. Maybe you will get it."
    - Strib commenter educating the elitists on the value of RBI's

  9. #149
    Super Moderator MVP USAFChief's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by snepp View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by USAFChief View Post
    Oh, I don't know. Average-ish in it's douch-ness, I'd say.
    What would you say its DORP is?
    fDORP or bDORP?

  10. #150
    Senior Member All-Star PseudoSABR's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by USAFChief View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by snepp View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by USAFChief View Post
    Oh, I don't know. Average-ish in it's douch-ness, I'd say.
    What would you say its DORP is?
    fDORP or bDORP?
    Well done, guys.

  11. #151
    Senior Member All-Star PseudoSABR's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheLeviathan View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by PseudoSABR View Post
    This post is excessively douchey, even for you.
    Absolutely intentional. It takes a lot of smug to pass Nick.

    That said, goes back to my point - all the predictions were ridiculous wishlists - not realistic.

    Just to recap: I suggest the offseason "rebuild to contend" posts were ridiculous and insane because they were unrealistic and wishful, get called out for being too harsh and that most people didn't think that, post just a small sample of a much richer pile of evidence to prove that plenty of people did, then get told all of those things were unrealistic and wishful. Right where I started.
    I'd say wishful, but not unrealistic. It's certainly within the realm of possibility for the Twins to spend money on FA and even make some cost-effective signings. Wishful, sure.

  12. #152
    Senior Member All-Star TheLeviathan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PseudoSABR View Post
    I'd say wishful, but not unrealistic. It's certainly within the realm of possibility for the Twins to spend money on FA and even make some cost-effective signings. Wishful, sure.
    By all means cite some examples of when one team has gone out and signed 2-3 of the top 7-10 FA starters in one offseason. Then we'll talk realistic. I don't doubt that the Twins "could" do this - I never said "impossible". I said insane and ridiculous because it was unrealistic. Again, you seem to have missed the point by imprinting your own interpretation. Which then got handed off to Nick to do the same errant interpretation.

  13. #153
    Senior Member All-Star PseudoSABR's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheLeviathan View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by PseudoSABR View Post
    I'd say wishful, but not unrealistic. It's certainly within the realm of possibility for the Twins to spend money on FA and even make some cost-effective signings. Wishful, sure.
    By all means cite some examples of when one team has gone out and signed 2-3 of the top 7-10 FA starters in one offseason. Then we'll talk realistic. I don't doubt that the Twins "could" do this - I never said "impossible". I said insane and ridiculous because it was unrealistic. Again, you seem to have missed the point by imprinting your own interpretation. Which then got handed off to Nick to do the same errant interpretation.
    Look, you're placing ridiculous conditions on these supposed unrealistic blueprints. You're just strawmanning. The Twins realistically could acquire three competent starters in any number of ways. They can trade, resign, and yes use FA; and they might find great value in 10-15 of SPers that other teams don't see.

    No one, I mean no one, suggested that the Twins were going to sign three of the top seven free agent starters. No one said that. So just quit it.

  14. #154
    Senior Member All-Star TheLeviathan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PseudoSABR View Post
    You're just strawmanning. The Twins realistically could acquire three competent starters in any number of ways. They can trade, resign, and yes use FA; and they might find great value in 10-15 of SPers that other teams don't see.
    You're equivocating. "Possible" does not equal "realistic". People are not suggesting just competent - you can go back and review my post as well if you'd like or check out the blueprints thread yourself. It was ridiculous to think it realistic to do what no team has done before. If you have precedent, by all means post it. If you don't - you are only suggesting what is literally not impossible. You aren't suggesting anything realistic.

  15. #155
    Pixel Monkey MVP Brock Beauchamp's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by snepp View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by USAFChief View Post
    Oh, I don't know. Average-ish in it's douch-ness, I'd say.
    What would you say its DORP is?
    I am cracking up over here.

  16. #156
    Senior Member All-Star YourHouseIsMyHouse's Avatar
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    Holy posts Batman!

  17. #157
    Speediest Moderator All-Star snepp's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brock Beauchamp View Post
    I am cracking up over here.
    Chief's reply killed me.
    "Maybe you could go grab a bat and ball… and learn something. Maybe you will get it."
    - Strib commenter educating the elitists on the value of RBI's

  18. #158
    Senior Member Big-Leaguer 70charger's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PseudoSABR View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by USAFChief View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by snepp View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by USAFChief View Post
    Oh, I don't know. Average-ish in it's douch-ness, I'd say.
    What would you say its DORP is?
    fDORP or bDORP?
    Well done, guys.
    I lulz'd.

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