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Thread: Mackey: Tom Kelly has changed his tune on Brian Dozier

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    Owner MVP Seth Stohs's Avatar
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    Mackey: Tom Kelly has changed his tune on Brian Dozier

    Mackey: Once critical, Tom Kelly has changed his tune on Brian Dozier - Minnesota Twins news | 1500 ESPN Twin Cities ? Minnesota Sports News & Opinion (Twins, Vikings, Wolves, Wild, Gophers) | Sportswire: Minnesota Twins

    In a Friday interview with Phil Mackey and Patrick Reusse on 1500espn, Tom Kelly had a lot to say about a lot of players and prospects. The Twins Hall of Fame manager is not one to hold back any punches. He also can admit to changing his opinion on players, and that is the case with Brian Dozier:

    "I will say, in my opinion, Mr. Dozier has improved immensely at second base," Kelly said. "I don't know if his little sessions over the winter time with Mr. Molitor helped or what, got through to his young man. But he looks much better. I don't know how everything's going to shake out here. ...
    "But I've never really been big on Dozier, and I was the first one to tell him about a week ago, boy, Dozier is 100% better. So in my opinion, he's done a real nice job from the transition from last year to this year."
    In the Twins organization, Tom Kelly's voice and his words are still as important as anyone's, so this is not just a minor thing.

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    Senior Member Big-Leaguer Oldgoat_MN's Avatar
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    Interesting.
    If Kelly likes him then maybe Gardy might even think he's adequate.
    If he hits, even the fans will like him.

    It's mostly about hitting for the fans. Of course, that helps win ballgames.

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    Owner MVP Seth Stohs's Avatar
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    Gardy loves him too, even after last year. I think some fans are the only ones that may not like him.

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    Senior Member All-Star Thrylos's Avatar
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    I think that he was clearly pressing last year. Maybe this year he will just go out and have fun and play. Hard to really achieve anything if you are pressing the whole time and your head is at the last awful PA or the last E...
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    Quote Originally Posted by Seth Stohs View Post
    Gardy loves him too, even after last year. I think some fans are the only ones that may not like him.
    What does it mean, to not like him or to "love" him?

    I think most of us believe that he's shown nothing beyond glimpses of success (and even that came when playing against players mostly younger than him) to warrant the hype he got last year (much of which came from the organization) or to even show he could be an ML regular for an extended period of time.

    Obviously it would be great if he somehow figured something out in the offseason that would change that expectation for a likeable, hard-working guy like Dozier.

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    Owner MVP Seth Stohs's Avatar
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    Dozier was 23 in AA, that isn't much older, it's just lower than league average. I just htink people make too big of a deal out of a rookie season that was admittedly rough. Who know what will happen in 2013? It's big for Dozier, but there's no reason to give up on him yet. And, if TK is seeing positive signs, that's good.

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    I think Dozier will be fine, he is probably why the Twins didn't make any mi moves this year.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Seth Stohs View Post
    Dozier was 23 in AA, that isn't much older, it's just lower than league average. I just htink people make too big of a deal out of a rookie season that was admittedly rough. Who know what will happen in 2013? It's big for Dozier, but there's no reason to give up on him yet. And, if TK is seeing positive signs, that's good.
    Not to nitpick, but Baseball Reference has him at 23 in Fort Myers and Beloit (2010) and then 24 in Fort Myers and New Britain (2011). He's a May birthday andturned 23 in 2010 and 24 in 2011, but since he didn't move straight to AA in 2011, he was more likely 24, or was only 23 for days at most, so most of his time in AA was as a 24 year old. While he might only be "older than average," if we compare his age to Florimon and Escobar, our other two uninspiring middle infielders, competing for the same spots,both were younger in AA.

    Meanwhile, Aaron Hicks did his mashing at AA at 22. Parmelee was 22. Joe Benson, 22. So, while Dozier may have been "only above average" the players I listed aren't expected to be much more than ML regulars/starters (except maybe Hicks) and all these guys were in AA before Dozier and hitting as well or better.

    My point, ultimately, is that his AA numbers at age 24 were used to evaluate him, so it's not a surprise that those numbers wouldn't be representative of what he could do in the majors and why most people thought he was rushed, or at least should have been better evaluated in AAA.
    Last edited by Alex; 03-02-2013 at 01:19 PM.

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    Senior Member Triple-A raindog's Avatar
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    Man I wish Tom Kelly was still manager. Maybe he'll unretire next year...

    I'm glad to hear this. I respect Tom Kelly's opinions.

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    Senior Member All-Star Badsmerf's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by raindog View Post
    Man I wish Tom Kelly was still manager. Maybe he'll unretire next year...

    I'm glad to hear this. I respect Tom Kelly's opinions.
    Why? I don't understand the TK love...
    Do or do not. There is no try.

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    In an interview on ESPN1500, I felt he was at least as impressed with Escobar.
    Last edited by jorgenswest; 03-02-2013 at 02:36 PM.

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    Senior Member Triple-A raindog's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Badsmerf View Post
    Why? I don't understand the TK love...
    He was very successful as a manager. He seems to hold statistics in higher regard than "instincts". Based on his announcing, he seems to have a sharp baseball mind. That's just my opinion.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Alex View Post
    Not to nitpick, but Baseball Reference has him at 23 in Fort Myers and Beloit (2010) and then 24 in Fort Myers and New Britain (2011). He's a May birthday andturned 23 in 2010 and 24 in 2011, but since he didn't move straight to AA in 2011, he was more likely 24, or was only 23 for days at most, so most of his time in AA was as a 24 year old. While he might only be "older than average," if we compare his age to Florimon and Escobar, our other two uninspiring middle infielders, competing for the same spots,both were younger in AA.

    Meanwhile, Aaron Hicks did his mashing at AA at 22. Parmelee was 22. Joe Benson, 22. So, while Dozier may have been "only above average" the players I listed aren't expected to be much more than ML regulars/starters (except maybe Hicks) and all these guys were in AA before Dozier and hitting as well or better.

    My point, ultimately, is that his AA numbers at age 24 were used to evaluate him, so it's not a surprise that those numbers wouldn't be representative of what he could do in the majors and why most people thought he was rushed, or at least should have been better evaluated in AAA.
    Dozier went to college...that'd explain the age thing

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by raindog View Post
    Man I wish Tom Kelly was still manager. Maybe he'll unretire next year...

    TK is the scary old warlock charged with keeping the flame of Playing-the-Game-the-Twins-Way burning bright. They keep him locked in his tower 10 months a year and then bring him to spring training to scare everyone into taking extra bases and hitting the cut-off man. He is too powerful to be unleashed full time. His we-win-this-way ideology has crushed more than a few fragile psyches and pissed off many others.
    Last edited by Dance with Disco Dan; 03-02-2013 at 04:41 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ThePuck View Post
    Dozier went to college...that'd explain the age thing
    That's the forgotten piece. Dozier actually went to 4 years of college. He was in the big leagues just less than 3 years after being drafted. Also, I don't think anyone expects Dozier's ceiling to be more than a solid regular in the big leagues. No one is predicting All Star games and the like.

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    Please ban me! All-Star stringer bell's Avatar
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    I certainly agree that Dozier was pressing last year. He showed enough to me that Twins' fans shouldn't give up on him. If Kelly is praising him, that is good news, because he is not one to give empty praise. I hope Dozier hits and fields well the rest of ST to give him confidence when the regular season starts. I'll repeat that he shouldn't be counted out as a shortstop long-term.

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    Senior Member All-Star LaBombo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Seth Stohs View Post
    Gardy loves him too, even after last year. I think some fans are the only ones that may not like him.
    Dozier seems to epitomize the kind of player most fans DO like, but who seems like a bit of a long shot to be an everyday player for a contender. And yes, he's only one guy, but so far part of a lengthy cautionary tale about skipping AAA in a year where the two most exciting Twins prospects are apparently being considered for...skipping AAA.

    At any rate, it's nice to hear that Kelly, who is a merciless evaluator of rookie fundamentals, thinks he's made progress. Lord knows there's not much else to be excited about with the other middle infield suspects.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Seth Stohs View Post
    That's the forgotten piece. Dozier actually went to 4 years of college. He was in the big leagues just less than 3 years after being drafted. Also, I don't think anyone expects Dozier's ceiling to be more than a solid regular in the big leagues. No one is predicting All Star games and the like.
    And I would have had no problems if he'd not been in the majors 4 years until after he was drafted.

    I'm fine with the idea that his ceiling is as a major league regular, and would love it if that occurs. But, people take the idea that those of us that have a more realistic expectation of him "don't like him." That realistic idea being that he's more likely a utility man and shouldn't be the Twins answer at a MI.

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    I like Dozier but he is a marginal big league regular, it really shouldn't be that surprising that he struggled during his debut and it wouldn't be shocking if he ends up back in AAA at some point this season as well. I'm glad to read about some of the positivity on him though. It would be nice if he could stick for a while, perhaps even in the 2 hole, and solidify that position. At least until Rosario is ready.
    Papers...business papers.

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    There is no reason not to give him a long look at 2B as long as his glove is solid. If his glove is good, I would not give up on his bat until he gets to the 1000 plate appearance threshold.

    There is no guarantee that Rosario will be able to play the position defensively. He may be a corner OF. Carroll isn't a solution. Santana or Michael may be a solution. Let's hope one of them steps up in New Britain. If not, Dozier is the best in house solution through 2015.

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