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Thread: Liriano

  1. #1
    Senior Member Triple-A kydoty's Avatar
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    Liriano

    Dude's about to go 9-3 with an ERA of 2.00 over 76.2 IP.

    Not saying we should've kept him. I'm just wondering what is so drastically different now than the last few years.

    "Mediocre breaking balls are a gift from God." - Kirby Puckett

  2. #2
    Senior Member Big-Leaguer
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    His stats are pretty similar to his 2010 stats - except his ERA.

    He seems to be giving up a lot of walks. The big number that is down is the HR number.
    He has only given up 3 HR in 76 IP
    In 2012 he gave up 19 in 156 IP
    His GB rate is back above 50%.
    For some reason in 2011 & 2012 he gave up more Fly Balls and more of those became HR. This looks to be the biggest statistical difference that stands out to me.

    Part of this must be from switching to the NL from the AL, also PNC park doesn't give up many HR.

  3. #3
    NL is always good to former twins pitchers........

  4. #4
    Senior Member All-Star Thrylos's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by clutterheart View Post
    His stats are pretty similar to his 2010 stats - except his ERA.

    He seems to be giving up a lot of walks. The big number that is down is the HR number.
    He has only given up 3 HR in 76 IP
    In 2012 he gave up 19 in 156 IP
    His GB rate is back above 50%.
    For some reason in 2011 & 2012 he gave up more Fly Balls and more of those became HR. This looks to be the biggest statistical difference that stands out to me.

    Part of this must be from switching to the NL from the AL, also PNC park doesn't give up many HR.
    While Target Field does

    The fact that his numbers are pretty close to his 2010 numbers (including the HR/9; other than his WHIP being a little less, due to the AL to NL change) is an astute observation.

    Why? Could be lots of reasons, including getting healthy from an undisclosed ailment, getting more confident and being able to pitch without thinking so much, getting a change of scenery and a fresh beginning, getting more effective coaching and (last but not least) entering his career prime. This is his age 29 season...
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  5. #5
    Senior Member All-Star IdahoPilgrim's Avatar
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    I'm glad for him he's having a good year.

    The question is what will he do next year? He had good years in 2008 and 2010 only to be followed by stinkers in 2009 and 2011 (and 2012).

    My guess, and I hope for his sake I'm wrong, is that he'll finish the year strong, and that this will be the year that makes Pittsburgh think they've found something and causes them to keep giving him chances the next two years, which will be sub-par.

    Nobody has said he doesn't have good stuff. He just has not been consistent from year-to-year. Maybe this time will be different

  6. #6
    Twins Moderator MVP USAFChief's Avatar
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    I'm in a small minority, but I thought the Twins should have extended Liriano (cheaply) last year. Too good of an arm to let go for basically nothing, especially for an organization so short on quality arms.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by USAFChief View Post
    I'm in a small minority, but I thought the Twins should have extended Liriano (cheaply) last year. Too good of an arm to let go for basically nothing, especially for an organization so short on quality arms.
    Probably would have needed a change of pitching coaches too.
    Papers...business papers.

  8. #8
    Senior Member Double-A
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    Relying on his slider. He's thrown more sliders this year than any year since his injury and less fastballs as well. Probably a good move if you struggle with your control regardless of pitch, might as well throw more of the one that generates swings and misses.

  9. #9
    Twins Moderator All-Star diehardtwinsfan's Avatar
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    I wouldn't have minded them extending him, but I get the distinct impression that Liriano needed a change of scenery more than anything else. Saw an article on him a month or two ago talking about how he made some minor adjustments to his pitching techniques as well.

  10. #10
    Twins News Team All-Star TheLeviathan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by iastfan112 View Post
    Relying on his slider. He's thrown more sliders this year than any year since his injury and less fastballs as well. Probably a good move if you struggle with your control regardless of pitch, might as well throw more of the one that generates swings and misses.
    That's also the pitch that he over-threw to a blown-out elbow. Might be something to watch for.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by kydoty View Post
    Dude's about to go 9-3 with an ERA of 2.00 over 76.2 IP.

    Not saying we should've kept him. I'm just wondering what is so drastically different now than the last few years.
    Could it be a team with a coach who can speak spanish?
    si si si yes it could be, to bad we Kept Drew around a couple years ago instead of signing Pudge Rodriquez to be Frankies personal guru catcher

  12. #12
    Is there any other reason than its his first full season away from Rick Anderson

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by iastfan112 View Post
    Relying on his slider. He's thrown more sliders this year than any year since his injury and less fastballs as well. Probably a good move if you struggle with your control regardless of pitch, might as well throw more of the one that generates swings and misses.
    Yup, he has been throwing the fastball a lot less. I dont know if that's something the pirates pitching staff worked with him on. Or if the Twins coaching staff just wanted him to pound the fastball even if he was all over the place. Either way, Ill never fault the twins for getting rid of him. We gave him so many chances. Yes, he'll prolly be the #2 starter if the Pirates make the playoffs and Im sure he will look good. Oh well!

  14. #14
    Senior Member All-Star Willihammer's Avatar
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    He's largely abandoned the 4 seemer. His change in pitch usage this year versus 2006-Jul 2012:



    Look at his profile page on brooksbaseball, the 4 seemer is the one that got hit the hardest, historically.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by USAFChief View Post
    I'm in a small minority, but I thought the Twins should have extended Liriano (cheaply) last year. Too good of an arm to let go for basically nothing, especially for an organization so short on quality arms.
    We couldn't force him to sign a cheap contract extension. Why would he? In his mind I am sure he thought he would turn it around in the second half and get a good contract. There would be no motivation to sign that kind of extension.

    The options available to the Twins last July were to trade him or retain him with hopes that he would pitch well enough to merit a qualifying offer. The Twins correctly assessed that he would not be worth a qualifying offer and traded him. They traded him and received a return in line with rental pitchers performing at his 2012 level.

    I don't see how extending him cheaply could ever have been an option.

  16. #16
    Twins Moderator MVP USAFChief's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jorgenswest View Post
    We couldn't force him to sign a cheap contract extension. Why would he? In his mind I am sure he thought he would turn it around in the second half and get a good contract. There would be no motivation to sign that kind of extension.
    Liriano was coming into free agency after a year in which he was posting a 5 ERA. He would have gladly listened to a 3 yr offer. Gladly.

    He ended up with $1M in guaranteed money from the Pirates. He and his agent aren't stupid.

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by greengoblinrulz View Post
    Is there any other reason than its his first full season away from Rick Anderson
    nope, that's about it

  18. #18
    Senior Member Big-Leaguer
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    Quote Originally Posted by kydoty View Post
    Dude's about to go 9-3 with an ERA of 2.00 over 76.2 IP.

    Not saying we should've kept him. I'm just wondering what is so drastically different now than the last few years.
    2 words why Liriano would have not had the same success if he would have resigned with Minneosta.
    Rick Anderson. Enough said...

  19. #19
    Senior Member Big-Leaguer
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    Quote Originally Posted by greengoblinrulz View Post
    Is there any other reason than its his first full season away from Rick Anderson
    Only other thing would be away from Gardy...

  20. #20
    Senior Member All-Star YourHouseIsMyHouse's Avatar
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    Who's that new Pirates ace? I've been following this guy and he's pretty good. I was thinking it might be Cole or Taillon, but this one throws lefty. Someone help me out?

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