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Thread: Sano sitting for a few days after how he handled himself hitting homerun

  1. #61
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    I've never thought hte "right way" as the right way. I think athletes have amazingly bizarre combinations of huge egos, and frail egos.
    Lighten up Francis....

  2. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by mike wants wins View Post
    What harm comes? I think sports are fun, and we are sucking the fun out. The guy hit a homerun, he should be happy and excited. There is only harm because people have decided it is bad, for no real reason. It does not actual harm, other than people inside their head. How you react to an event is on you, not on the event.
    You didn't answer my question. I asked what good comes from this, not what harm. No good thing comes from showboating like that. None. Sano's (or someone else's) career can be ended as well. Even if it isn't, that doesn't provide any sort of strategic advantage over the opposing team. Nothing good can come from it.

  3. #63
    Senior Member Triple-A maxisagod's Avatar
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    Oh and this is a minor point, but what if the ball hadn't gone out but just hit the wall? Longest single ever. On a hit like that Sano needs to be standing on second base.

  4. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jim H View Post
    This is one place where the Twins do not deserve any criticism. I listened to Dan Barrerio try to play both sides of this issue on the way home from work. There is no real question, this what you should do when anyone, major league or minor league crosses the line. Set him down for a few days. Unless you really liked the behavior of the Manny Rameriez's of this world, I don't understand how anyone can be upset with the Twins, here.

    The minor leagues is where kids learn how to play like major leaguers. They should also learn how to act like major leaguers. There are exceptions, but baseball players generally act like professionals. Unlike many football players and basketball players. I appreciate that the Twins do more than talk about their players acting professionally. This has nothing to do with curbing personality. Harmon Killebrew, Tony Olivia, Kirby Puckett, Kent Hrbek and many others had plenty of personality, but it didn't keep them from acting professionally on the field.

    I agree with the previous poster, who said act like you been there before.
    Spot on. And, you'd obviously bench below-average minor-leaguer X for show boating. You need to correct idiots. But, then Sano does the same thing.... if you don't hand out the same punishment, you set a dangerous precedent. He's now above the rules, and the organization. You want him show up at optional workouts in the big leagues? Make him behave like everyone else now.

  5. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by darin617 View Post
    Twins fans don't worry about Sano's attitude. When he makes his MLB debut in 3 years he will have grown out of such things.

    One thing I didn't see commented about by anyone but there may be some history with the pitcher. Does anyone even know who the pitcher was?
    ???????Are you being ironically sarcastic? He better be debuting in September or sometime in 2014!

  6. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by E. Andrew View Post
    Spot on. And, you'd obviously bench below-average minor-leaguer X for show boating. You need to correct idiots. But, then Sano does the same thing.... if you don't hand out the same punishment, you set a dangerous precedent. He's now above the rules, and the organization. You want him show up at optional workouts in the big leagues? Make him behave like everyone else now.
    It's a fine line, I'm not defending Sano as I didn't like the showboating, but I also don't want him transformed into a deferrential Minnesota boy-scout. However you said below-average minor-leaguers have been benched for this. I'm just wondering if people have examples of multi-game suspensions for this kind of bravado? A benching for the rest of the game seems like it would occur often, but do other teams other than the Twins have players sit multiple games?

  7. #67
    Super Moderator All-Star twinsnorth49's Avatar
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    There has always been a dichotomy between confidence and arrogance, this is really just an issue of maturity in my opinion. Sano is definitely a confident young man, as he should be, his display however reeked of arrogance and nobody appreciates that.

    The problem arises if he never learns the difference.
    Last edited by twinsnorth49; 07-26-2013 at 10:26 AM.

  8. #68
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    I did answer your question.....since no harm comes, other than how stupid ballplayers are about it, it shouldn't be an issue. I think it is fun to watch a relief pitcher show emotion when he strikes out that key guy. I just don't see the harm, and if there is no harm, it should be ok. This is like the NFL outlawing TD celebrations, some of them were fun, but because players feel "shown up" for no reason, they outlawed them. Just silliness, imo. It is entertainment.
    Lighten up Francis....

  9. #69
    Super Moderator All-Star twinsnorth49's Avatar
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    There's lots of ways to display respectful ways of emotion that still qualify as fun, start advocating this kind of thing however and the next thing you know we have the NBA.

    He hit a HR, ok, he's hit them before, enjoy it but at least act like you've done it before.

  10. #70
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    A few people have mentioned a "suspension"- I believe he's just sitting out a few games, he's not officially suspended. He sits on the bench, he keeps his paycheck, he supports his team- big difference compared to a suspension from a morale standpoint.

  11. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by JB_Iowa View Post
    It's a learning experience for him.

    I'm sure it is a fine line between making sure players respect the "rules of the game" (even the unwritten ones) and crushing their spirit.

    I, too, would prefer that Twins players should a little more liveliness in general but there are times to do that and times not to do that.

    I think TRex is correct about his struggles at AA weighing on him. So a break may be good for him.

    This points out one of the concerns I have with the abundance of minor league coverage. It's great that people are interested in prospects but we all need to remember that many of them are pretty young kids. Everything tends to get blown out of proportion by the blogosphere, commenters and yes, now the mainstream media too. Not sure that benching Sano (or a similar high end prospect) would have been even a blip 20 years ago.
    The thing about his time at AA is, the "struggles" are actually luck-related more than his troubles adjusting to the Eastern League. His BB rate is actually 2% higher than at Ft Myers (13.9% vs. 11.9%), representing a 17% increase in his walk rate at New Britain. Meanwhile, his K rate is only slightly higher than with the Miracle (about 5%). He's slugging at a very, very, torrid clip- a .562 SLG -- if he qualified, that mark would rank him second overall in the EL!
    His .895 OPS is just a blip behind teammate Josmil Pinto, who at .899 is 3rd in the EL in that category.
    Furthermore, his isolated power rate of .331 is actually six points higher than with Ft Myers (.325).
    Putting that in perspective, the qualifying leader in Isolated Power in the Eastern League is Allan Dykstra. His ISO is a full 55 points behind Sano, at .276!

    The only big discrepancy that stands out is his BABIP of .237 (vs a .397 BABIP with the Miracle). So, he really hasn't been struggling, physically. Mentally, maybe, more a victim of his bad luck at the plate and being in the glare of the spotlight from the Futures Game hype and all the expectations of recently moving up to #3 in the BA rankings.

    The article you linked to provides the bulk of the concern over Sano on this issue, JB:


    "There is no time frame for Sano's return, Twins farm director Brad Steil said Thursday.


    "Just a normal player-development decision," Steil said, declining to characterize the misdeed. "We have discipline for all sorts of things that we do. This is one of them. He's not going to play for a few games."
    Last edited by jokin; 07-26-2013 at 10:43 AM.

  12. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by big dog View Post
    A few people have mentioned a "suspension"- I believe he's just sitting out a few games, he's not officially suspended. He sits on the bench, he keeps his paycheck, he supports his team- big difference compared to a suspension from a morale standpoint.
    See my post for the quote from Twins management on his "official" status.

  13. #73
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    I really don't think Sano will ever learn this particular lesson. He did the same thing with Beloit, he did the same thing with Ft Myers, and now he's doing it with New Britain. And people still don't want the Twins to do anything about it? Whatever. Good luck ever being able to treat him like anything but a prima donna if you wait 'til he's in Minnesota to even try.

    Going all the way back to the 16 yr old Sano in the documentary, he's come off as "me first" kid. Given his background, that's not surprising, but I don't have to like that he hasn't grown out of that yet and doesn't appear likely to.

    I do think it's unfortunate for the fans who aren't getting to see his talent on the field while he's benched and if it costs his team some wins, his team mates pay an unfair price, too. Maybe sitting him a game and then dropping his butt to #9 in the order for a week or more would be as effective and still let fans see him hit. His ego might smart just as much from that as it would from a benching.

    Either way, I'm not confident he'll ever learn this particular "lesson" and one day someone will put one in his ear.

    I'm a Twins fan and I hope to be able to watch Sano's talent on display in a Twins uniform for a long time. But I don't have to "like" every Twins player, regardless of their talent. I'm a big Byron Buxton fan, but I am starting to think I may never really like Sano beyond simply for what he can accomplish statistically for my particular favorite team.

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  14. #74
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    Didn't he hit one last year against Cedar Rapids that led to a bench clearing brawl?

  15. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by SD Buhr View Post
    I really don't think Sano will ever learn this particular lesson. He did the same thing with Beloit, he did the same thing with Ft Myers, and now he's doing it with New Britain. And people still don't want the Twins to do anything about it? Whatever. Good luck ever being able to treat him like anything but a prima donna if you wait 'til he's in Minnesota to even try.

    Going all the way back to the 16 yr old Sano in the documentary, he's come off as "me first" kid. Given his background, that's not surprising, but I don't have to like that he hasn't grown out of that yet and doesn't appear likely to.

    I do think it's unfortunate for the fans who aren't getting to see his talent on the field while he's benched and if it costs his team some wins, his team mates pay an unfair price, too. Maybe sitting him a game and then dropping his butt to #9 in the order for a week or more would be as effective and still let fans see him hit. His ego might smart just as much from that as it would from a benching.

    Either way, I'm not confident he'll ever learn this particular "lesson" and one day someone will put one in his ear.

    I'm a Twins fan and I hope to be able to watch Sano's talent on display in a Twins uniform for a long time. But I don't have to "like" every Twins player, regardless of their talent. I'm a big Byron Buxton fan, but I am starting to think I may never really like Sano beyond simply for what he can accomplish statistically for my particular favorite team.
    And what's so wrong with that? It seems like once-in-a-generation talent is already being written off by a certain segment of Twins fandom. Gee whiz, he's 20 with an enormous set of talent, who has worked hard to get his fielding to the point that the Twins are now saying that fielding is one of his strong points, not a hindrance to promotion. His ego to this point is not what's holding him back, it's a basic element essential in how he got to this point in the first place.

    I'm guessing 29 other teams have already heard from his agent....and gladly took the call. Like other great talents (but lesser than Sano...Ortiz, Garza, Lohse, etc.), look for the exasperated Twins to be moving Sano during his arb years for less than full realized value. Ouch!

  16. #76
    Senior Member All-Star cmathewson's Avatar
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    I would be upset about this if it was the first time he's done something like this this year. But he had a similar incident in Fort Myers and I'm sure the Twins thought that he was past all that after his last discipline.

    All that said, I saw Torii Hunter flip his bat that way in a Twins uniform at least 100 times. So I can't say what so bad about it. He does need to jog and not trot, though.
    "If you'da been thinkin' you wouldn't 'a thought that.."

  17. #77
    Gee - the usual suspects on both sides taking their arguments to the extremes. How refreshing!

  18. #78
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    Quote Originally Posted by SD Buhr View Post
    I'm a Twins fan and I hope to be able to watch Sano's talent on display in a Twins uniform for a long time. But I don't have to "like" every Twins player, regardless of their talent. I'm a big Byron Buxton fan, but I am starting to think I may never really like Sano beyond simply for what he can accomplish statistically for my particular favorite team.
    Yeah, I want every Twins player to be an upstanding citizen and humble humanitarian, but I think we all understand it's not going to happen.

    I don't want Sano to behave like Manny Rameriz, but if that type of attitude helps to enable that kind of production and ability to come through in the clutch to win big games, I'll definately take the trade off.

    Even if he is hard to embrace due to his attitude, a successfull team is very easy to embrace and he may be able to help in that regard.

    That being said, I don't think it's fair for us to assume he has a bad attitude. It's premature and an overconfident HR celebration probably shouldn't be admissable evidence.
    Last edited by nicksaviking; 07-26-2013 at 11:47 AM.

  19. #79
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    Quote Originally Posted by TwinsFanInPhilly View Post
    Gee - the usual suspects on both sides taking their arguments to the extremes. How refreshing!
    Based on your "like", you've evidently cast your lot with one of those "extreme" sides. Rather than inflame the debate with needless trolling ("how refreshing!"), please state where you stand on the issue to add to the debate. One thing both sides agree on is that Sano is being counted on as one of the Centerpieces in returning the franchise to relevancy. This naturally means that passion and interest level would run high.

  20. #80
    Senior Member All-Star JB_Iowa's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jokin View Post
    The only big discrepancy that stands out is his BABIP of .237 (vs a .397 BABIP with the Miracle). So, he really hasn't been struggling, physically. Mentally, maybe, more a victim of his bad luck at the plate and being in the glare of the spotlight from the Futures Game hype and all the expectations of recently moving up to #3 in the BA rankings.
    How you respond to "bad luck" is also part of growing as a ballplayer. And frankly, so is how you respond to being benched for a few days.

    This episode and the resulting benching of Sano may very well tell us (and the Twins) a lot more about Sano than we know now.

    I don't want them to take away all of his attitude. But there are players with a lot of attitude who don't showboat. Learning where that line lies is part of his maturation as a ballplayer.

    And I want to reiterate my point from the end of my 2nd post. Modern media magnifies all of this in ways that we just wouldn't have seen in the past.

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