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Thread: Article: Waitin' With the Wings: Josmil Pinto

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    Twins Contributor Big-Leaguer Cody Christie's Avatar
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    Article: Waitin' With the Wings: Josmil Pinto


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    Senior Member All-Star Thrylos's Avatar
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    Good stuff, other than this tidbit:
    Since leaving Beloit in 2011, Pinto has allowed 13 passed balls in 165 games behind the plate. He needs to continue to work on his game-calling skills but his offensive threat might be too much to ignore.
    You need a reference point if you are going to toss defensive numbers, and here is one:

    The "amazing, incredible, 'elite'" defensive catcher Drew Butera has allowed 15 passed balls in 183 games (one in every 12.2 games) behind the plate in MLB, and 74 in 476 games in the minors (one every 6.4 games)

    Pinto's rate for the period you indicate is one passed ball per 12.7 games. If Butera is "elite", Pinto is super-elite. The truth is some place in the middle. Pinto is not as bad a defensive catcher as it has been alleged, and Butera is not as good. I have seen Pinto catch is several games and he has been fine.

    As far as his power numbers go, I expect more. He has been filling up big time and he is more muscular than Arcia at this point. And a lot of the increase of his numbers as he is moving up the system has to do with the fact that he is not 155 lbs as he was as a 17 year old, but close to 230...

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    Senior Member All-Star Shane Wahl's Avatar
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    I like the LH/RH combo of Herrmann and Pinto as pieces on the bench/semi-starting. Having "three catchers" won't be a bad roster move anymore.

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    Senior Member Double-A
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    I think he could make Doumit a trade candidate this off season.

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    Twins Moderator All-Star diehardtwinsfan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tjsyam921 View Post
    I think he could make Doumit a trade candidate this off season.
    yes. SSS I know, but he's hitting over .400 in AAA right now. He'll come back to earth, but the extra level hasn't seemed to hurt him at all. He's the next Doumit, whether that be this offseason or at the deadline. I like it b/c defensively he's better, and he can allow for Mauer to do a bit more 1B/DHing.

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    Senior Member Triple-A Don't Feed the Greed Guy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shane Wahl View Post
    I like the LH/RH combo of Herrmann and Pinto as pieces on the bench/semi-starting. Having "three catchers" won't be a bad roster move anymore.
    Absolutely. The 2013 draft may also be seen as a precursor for the post-Mauer era, with catchers Stuart Turner (round 3), Brian Navarreto (round 6), and Mitch Garver (round 9) all signed.

    It will be interesting to see the Twins moves at catcher over the next five years, until Mauer's contract expires, at the end of 2018. The Butera trade broke up the logjam. If nothing else, it brought good flow to the development of Pinto, Herrmann, and the heirs apparent in the lower levels.

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    Senior Member Triple-A
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    Going out on a limb here but I think Pinto is the only player who hasn't seen the majors yet who gets a September callup.

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    doumit isn't actually that good at any one thing, he's just able to do a lot of them kind of well, making his value in his versatility, not actually being a good hitter or defender.....

    I'm ready to move on, having an older player that isn't even average on this roster makes no sense. time. to. move. on.

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    Quote Originally Posted by DJL44 View Post
    Going out on a limb here but I think Pinto is the only player who hasn't seen the majors yet who gets a September callup.
    Probably not a long limb. He is probably the only one who has a good chance.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mike wants wins View Post
    doumit isn't actually that good at any one thing, he's just able to do a lot of them kind of well, making his value in his versatility, not actually being a good hitter or defender.....

    I'm ready to move on, having an older player that isn't even average on this roster makes no sense. time. to. move. on.
    I would bet the Twins agree but couldn't trade him. Probably too valuable to release.

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    Ya, it is an odd spot....the versatility and value are there, so he's hard to just cut. I don't have a good answer for this one.
    Lighten up Francis....

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    Please ban me! All-Star stringer bell's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tjsyam921 View Post
    I think he could make Doumit a trade candidate this off season.
    I have been liking Pinto since Spring Training. I called all season for Doumit to be traded at the deadline, but that didn't happen, perhaps because no one wanted to part with anything to acquire him. Maybe someone will make the move this month. Anyway, Pinto has had an outstanding season so far and would profile as a hitter that won't struggle too much at the next level because of his plate discipline. I have pictured a four for three situation (Mauer, Pinto, Parmelee and Willingham) at DH, 1B, and the outfield corners as the ideal for 2014.

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    RE: Thrylos

    That is a single stat, most of which for a catcher are tough to calculate. I've never seen Pinto catch before but Butera is excellent behind the plate. He calls a great game, he receives the ball with the best of them, blocks the ball very well and has a strong, accurate arm. There was a reason Pavano had Butera catch for him and IMO, I believe Pavano wasn't getting the lower half of the zone called strikes when Mauer catches. That was been a concern of Mauer's from day one, since he is so tall, it is tough for umpires to see the bottom of the strike zone.

    Quote Originally Posted by Thrylos View Post
    Good stuff, other than this tidbit:


    You need a reference point if you are going to toss defensive numbers, and here is one:

    The "amazing, incredible, 'elite'" defensive catcher Drew Butera has allowed 15 passed balls in 183 games (one in every 12.2 games) behind the plate in MLB, and 74 in 476 games in the minors (one every 6.4 games)

    Pinto's rate for the period you indicate is one passed ball per 12.7 games. If Butera is "elite", Pinto is super-elite. The truth is some place in the middle. Pinto is not as bad a defensive catcher as it has been alleged, and Butera is not as good. I have seen Pinto catch is several games and he has been fine.

    As far as his power numbers go, I expect more. He has been filling up big time and he is more muscular than Arcia at this point. And a lot of the increase of his numbers as he is moving up the system has to do with the fact that he is not 155 lbs as he was as a 17 year old, but close to 230...

  14. #14
    Please ban me! All-Star stringer bell's Avatar
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    For the record, Pinto isn't as tall as either Mauer or Doumit, so that portion of his catching shouldn't be an issue. From what I've seen, he is okay behind the plate, but I am certainly no expert on the subtleties of catching.

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    Senior Member Big-Leaguer Oldgoat_MN's Avatar
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    Pinto is listed as 5'11". I posted another time that the catchers who get the best 'framing' calls are pretty much all 6'1" or shorter. (wasn't just an opinion - I had names and heights listed)

    I suspect that Mauer's height does impede the umpires' vision to some extent.

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