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Thread: Article: 2013 Twins Postmortem: What Went Wrong

  1. #21
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    I never saw any fire in the team (it's even worse now!) that suggested that they believed this would be a winning season. That must change! I repeat--there is way too much emphasis on pitch-count and walks. The hitters need to get more aggressive on the first pitch and not permit the opposing P an easy strike one. These young guys also have to dial-it-down with two strikes and focus on making solid contact rather than swinging for the fences. Twins pitchers need to use their off-speed pitches more frequently.

  2. #22
    Senior Member All-Star Shane Wahl's Avatar
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    Colabello, Parmelee, and Plouffe make sense as platoon players going forward. I still think that Colabello's power numbers are worth another look.

    We are such a damn impatient bunch, aren't we? Smart phones and whatnot ruin our minds. What to expect from ROOKIES like Hicks, Colabello, Arcia, and Gibson? Dominance? What?

    Everyone needs to calm down. Let the youth play and deal with it. Since Gardy doesn't like it. Send him away. Anderson too. These are *obvious* decisions to make.

  3. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by Shane Wahl View Post
    Colabello, Parmelee, and Plouffe make sense as platoon players going forward. I still think that Colabello's power numbers are worth another look.

    We are such a damn impatient bunch, aren't we? Smart phones and whatnot ruin our minds. What to expect from ROOKIES like Hicks, Colabello, Arcia, and Gibson? Dominance? What?

    Everyone needs to calm down. Let the youth play and deal with it. Since Gardy doesn't like it. Send him away. Anderson too. These are *obvious* decisions to make.
    Your point is well taken. My expectation -- "hope" is probably a better word -- is that one or more of the guys billed as top prospects (Arcia, Gibson, Hicks) would have been able to last on the major league roster of one of the very worst teams in baseball without playing themselves back to AAA. Yes, I know this is common (happened to Hunter, Span, many more), but quite simply it would have been nice to see more of the big names step up this season when the Twins desperately needed it.
    Andrew Walter
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  4. #24
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    Well, Hicks was historically bad, and not great on defense. Would it be unreasonable for us not to expect one of the worst hitters ever? Gibson? I think it is reasonable to expect him not to post an ERA that gets him sent to AAA again, given his age and pedigree.
    Lighten up Francis....

  5. #25
    Well last year Dozier was historically bad too. And now look. I don't think it's that big a deal that no one stuck very well. I think it was more just coincidence that these guys are all at a similar stage of development(we didn't have many good AAA prospects this year). Now if the same thing happens next year I'd be worried, because that excuse won't fly for a number of them. Arcia, Hicks, Gibson etc. better show some improvement. I'm really looking forward to seeing Arcia hit the ball to the upper deck.

  6. #26
    Senior Member All-Star Shane Wahl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Twins Fan From Afar View Post
    Your point is well taken. My expectation -- "hope" is probably a better word -- is that one or more of the guys billed as top prospects (Arcia, Gibson, Hicks) would have been able to last on the major league roster of one of the very worst teams in baseball without playing themselves back to AAA. Yes, I know this is common (happened to Hunter, Span, many more), but quite simply it would have been nice to see more of the big names step up this season when the Twins desperately needed it.
    I was being provocative in order to get a good response like this from you (and you in particular!).

    I understand completely. I also think that there is something amiss with Gardenhire and co. with regard to dealing with youth. Gardy seems to be weird about certain people and who knows what goes on behind the scenes with regard to that.

    That said, I like the homer power that even Hicks displayed through all the badness. Arcia, Colabello, and even Herrmann did that too. That's something to look at aside from overall performance.

  7. #27
    Senior Member All-Star Shane Wahl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mike wants wins View Post
    Well, Hicks was historically bad, and not great on defense. Would it be unreasonable for us not to expect one of the worst hitters ever? Gibson? I think it is reasonable to expect him not to post an ERA that gets him sent to AAA again, given his age and pedigree.
    Leave April out of the picture and doesn't the picture change with regard to Hicks? If that were his full season, wouldn't you not mind it so much as a rookie skipping a level?

  8. #28
    Senior Member All-Star Shane Wahl's Avatar
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    Finally, I have said this before: there are two prospects in this organization who I think can straight up skip AAA if needed. Those two are Buxton and Sano. Other than that there is value in seeing AAA pitching since it is going to be different than AA pitching.

    It's like in The Sopranos: breaking balls once in awhile is a necessary thing. Seeing more breaking balls in AAA is a necessary thing . . .

  9. #29
    Senior Member All-Star Shane Wahl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Twins Fan From Afar View Post
    Your point is well taken. My expectation -- "hope" is probably a better word -- is that one or more of the guys billed as top prospects (Arcia, Gibson, Hicks) would have been able to last on the major league roster of one of the very worst teams in baseball without playing themselves back to AAA. Yes, I know this is common (happened to Hunter, Span, many more), but quite simply it would have been nice to see more of the big names step up this season when the Twins desperately needed it.
    Also, in the Arcia thread I just asked a question about his OF defense in the minors. Do you have any insight on that? The question is about whether or not the indecisiveness and clumsiness (the Delmon factor) was common in the minors or if this MLB Arcia defense is different than his previous time out there. I like to know from people who have seen him . . .

  10. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by howieramone View Post
    Good job on the article! I wasn't expecting much this year and wasn't disappointed. I look at it a little differently.

    2013 Actual Hicks, Pressly, Arcia, Gibson, Thielbar, Presly, Pinto

    2014 Projected Sano, Buxton, Rosario, Meyer, May

    Some played their way into our future plans and probably an equal number played themselves out of consideration. I would also add Dozier someplace. The future is much clearer than it was.
    I would be a little surprised to see Rosario and Buxton on the 2014 Twins. Rosario looks like he needs at least another full season in the minors and they probably won't rush Buxton.

  11. #31
    Senior Member Triple-A Thegrin's Avatar
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    2013 went predictably wrong. The Twins started with only 4 proven major league hitters: Mauer, Morneau, Willingham & Doumit. In 2012 we had the same 4 + Span and Revere.
    That is 6 proven major league hitters. We all know that Florimon, Parmalee, Hicks have all flopped as hitters and Willingham and Doumit have had terrible seasons. Plouffe and Dozier had mixed results. Despite the lack of hitting, the Twins will lose about the same number of games as past years, despite worse starting pitching.

  12. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by lyndon View Post
    I don't really think anything went wrong. The players we have are just not that good (with a few exceptions). Anything that went wrong was well before the season started. Expecting my 03 Chevy Impala to win the Indy 500 is just unrealistic. In other news bring on Sano, Buxton, Rosario, Meyer,etc. Can hardly wait for 2014! Even though we'll probably still suck, it should be fun to watch.
    What if you were given an adequate budget to build an Indy car, but instead pocketed that money and decided to enter the race with your Impala instead? Do you still blame the car, or do you blame the guy in charge of building a competitive car?

  13. #33
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    Or we could just ask what went right and it would be a whole lot easier......

  14. #34
    The Twins inability to shed not only salary but potential free agent Pelfry, as well as taking something, anything, for Correia and Willingham. Maybe they can bring back something more in 2014.

    The bullpen got worn out. Not just because of innings, but appearances.

    The Twins may have had the ability to deal from a position of strength, finding new homes for Swarzak, Duensing, Roeincke, Burton...but they didn't. All of the aforementioned pitchers are replaceable.

    They made a decision on Perkins. We get to see if he can hold onto his status in 2014 when he is still dealable, or re-signable beyond his option.

    Hicks was an enigma. The Twins actually thought they had strength and competition going into the season: Benson, Mastro and Hicks. They gave up totally on Benson. mastro has lost his speed with injury. Hicks should've gone down sooner and worked his arse off at AAA. Thomas is a bad placeholder. We all miss Revere, Span and Gomez...and almost wish Hunter had come back, although the Twins still couldn't afford him.

    To think Cole DeVries was in the rotation to start the season. And now he's in the rotation to end the season. So many arms. So much work. Who will step forth in 2014. Albers and Deduno have had ups and downs. Correia is steady. Hendriks, Gibson, Hernandez, Diamond are all on the bubble. Maybe a couple could do long-relief (which made the non-trading of Swarzak and Duensing unbearable in my mind).

    Line-up construction. Considering the only guy who produced at one point was the #7 prospect. But still...no one getting on base made Mauer pretty lonely out there in the infield when he reached base.

    The rroe I think about Morneau, I can live with him being gone and not coming back. But who's on first? Looks like Mauer. Pinto has been a ray of sunshine.

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