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Thread: Article: Naming Names: Three Starting Pitchers The Twins Should Target

  1. #21
    Senior Member Big-Leaguer
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    Quote Originally Posted by Major Leauge Ready View Post
    Me too. I really don't even know why but I will go down with you if he tanks.

    I would love to see Nolasco, Feldman, and Kazmir. That might have even been possible if the damn TV money did not hit this year. If they got two of these three I would consider it a win. They could easily be able to afford Crain and Loney or Morales.
    I am going to go with Nolasco and Kazmir, then maybe Arroyo if they get 3 starters with Feldman as a back up option. The benefit of Kazmir is he is a lefty and only looking for a 2 year deal. Pay an extra 2 million and be done at 2/18 or 2/20. I think we could get Nolasco with a 5 year deal but i dont think the Twins will go over 4. Arroyo will be good for 2 seasons maybe 3. 2/25 or 3/36. Still money for a 1B and back up IF who can play good defense at SS and 3B and a Johan Santana make good contract...

  2. #22
    Senior Member All-Star Shane Wahl's Avatar
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    Now I realize why Volquez was so sneaky--it's because he's bad. Fantastic in 2008. Declining ever since.

  3. #23
    I agree that the Twins need to take a chance on not just one, but perhaps two pitchers who will be on the team for 4-5 seasons (again, you can always trade them). Come the 2015 or 2016 season, you can then get that 1-2 year stop gapper. You don't need the 1-2 year stop gapper now, unless you go totally into the trade after a season mode...which is also a gamble (didn't happen with Pavano or Pelfrey). You also need to see if you can get value up for the likes of Worley, Diamond, Deduno and now in 2014 Correia. Frankly, none of those names I pictures being around in 2016.

  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rosterman View Post
    I agree that the Twins need to take a chance on not just one, but perhaps two pitchers who will be on the team for 4-5 seasons (again, you can always trade them). Come the 2015 or 2016 season, you can then get that 1-2 year stop gapper. You don't need the 1-2 year stop gapper now, unless you go totally into the trade after a season mode...which is also a gamble (didn't happen with Pavano or Pelfrey). You also need to see if you can get value up for the likes of Worley, Diamond, Deduno and now in 2014 Correia. Frankly, none of those names I pictures being around in 2016.
    I think it's safe to say, the Twins will not be adding 2 starting pitchers with 4-5 year contracts, and even safer to say you can not always trade them. As is, I believe our farm system will take care of our starting pitching needs no later than 2017. I look for us to add several mid-range free agents with 2-3 year contracts. If Ryan pulls a rabbit out of his hat, it will be a trade involving some of our prospects in the 5-15 range.

  5. #25
    Senior Member All-Star Thrylos's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shane Wahl View Post
    Now I realize why Volquez was so sneaky--it's because he's bad. Fantastic in 2008. Declining ever since.
    Define "bad". I bet he would had been the Ace for the Twins in 2013.
    Last edited by Thrylos; 11-09-2013 at 07:34 PM.
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  6. #26
    Pixel Monkey MVP Brock Beauchamp's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Linus View Post
    I like the three that you ended up with. I'm not sure about all the love for Phil Hughes at TD. He basically has been Kevin Correia over the last three years only not as durable. If he gets 3 / 33 like some are suggesting is reasonable, then we need to put up a Terry Ryan statue for signing Correia for 2/12.
    We're bullish on Hughes because he is a pretty good pitcher when he's not in Yankee Stadium. That stadium punishes guys like Hughes. Looking at his overall stat line doesn't tell the entire story. Get him out of that park and he could easily be the second coming of Scott Baker.

  7. #27
    Senior Member All-Star Shane Wahl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thrylos View Post
    Define "bad". I bet he would had been the Ace for the Twins in 2013.
    He had a 5.71 ERA and the worst of it was in San Diego! He has been *bad* for three years and only had one great season to begin with. A career 83 ERA+ is not a good sign. Maybe for much younger pitchers, but not here. No way.

  8. #28
    Senior Member All-Star Thrylos's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shane Wahl View Post
    He had a 5.71 ERA and the worst of it was in San Diego! He has been *bad* for three years and only had one great season to begin with. A career 83 ERA+ is not a good sign. Maybe for much younger pitchers, but not here. No way.

    ERA? Really?
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  9. #29
    Thrylos...Great article. This is why we go to Twins Daily, to read a well thought out, well written piece about our favorite baseball team and how they could become fun to watch again (someday). We can all quibble on the specifics...that's what makes this fun, entertaining and educational. I'm intrigued by the premise that the Twins need to bring in 3 guys, and I agree, that whoever they bring in needs to be viewed as our #1, #2 and possibly #3. Meyer, Deduno, Worley, Gibson etc...give us a lot of options but a lot of unknowns. What we do need to do is improve this sorry SP rotation. The best guy to bring in is Tanaka. He fits all the criteria to a "T" but if the Yanks, Dodgers, Red Sox etc...are going all in on him, we will be out bid. It disappoints me to have to accept that, but that's reality. I agree with those who are bullish on Kazmir. Good grief, the Twins couldn't hit him a lick last year. I agree with those who are high on Hughes. Get him out of Yankee Stadium, we could very well get lucky with that. If we start with Kazmir and Hughes we are already 200% better than last year. Who would be #3. Ubaldo would be a terrific signing but our #2 will be pretty high, that's a negative. If you can get a Josh Johnson or Volquez fairly cheaply and leave yourself a little $$$ to add a bat I would give Terry Ryan an "A" for his off season. Since I'm much more accustomed to giving him D's and F's I'll remain skeptical. The Twins FO and the Pohlad's have to know the Twins have lost 50% of their TV audience in the last 3 years. I'm sure the radio audience is even worse. When that starts happening, attendance is set to tank in the not too distant future. If they don't get their #*#@! together this off season even when they young talent comes up, they might not see the interest in their ballclub come back right away. The clock is ticking...

  10. #30
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    I think the Twins almost HAVE to sign Kazmir. He won't be expensive...per se...and they need a lefthander in the rotation. Im not sold on either Canadian being able to cut it in a lefthander starting role as much as I hope they do. I also would sign Tanaka. Period.He will be expensive. But he wont cost a draft pick and would still be pitching for the next wave. And we could always flip him for prospects down the road unless he really tanked. I would not sign any other pitchers.
    Last edited by pierre75275; 11-10-2013 at 01:29 PM.

  11. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by nicksaviking View Post
    I didn't claim that strikeouts guarantee positive results but the previous poster discounted them completely. They are however one of the best indicators if only using basic stats. Did any strikeout heavy free agents have a poor year last season?
    If you are referring to the free agents signed after the 2012 season, Jackson, Haren, and many others. If you are referring to the upcoming free agents, Hughes, Volques and others.

    Strikeout rates are fine to look at. But if you are going to spend a lot of money on someone as free agent, I would think you would look at the total picture. ERA, innings pitched, innings per start, BB rate, and probably several other things as well.

  12. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jim H View Post
    If you are referring to the free agents signed after the 2012 season, Jackson, Haren, and many others. If you are referring to the upcoming free agents, Hughes, Volques and others.

    Strikeout rates are fine to look at. But if you are going to spend a lot of money on someone as free agent, I would think you would look at the total picture. ERA, innings pitched, innings per start, BB rate, and probably several other things as well.
    By saying this you imply that I ask for pitchers who get strikeouts only and could care less about any other factors. I've got a pretty one track mind about the kinds of pitchers this team needs, but I'm not blind to other factors. I want quality pitchers, i just want them to also be able to strike batters out, and this year there are plenty of them.

    Volquez was bad last year, he didn't cross my mind (or most people's). Looking at the other free agents with (reasonably) high strikeout rates, Haren was also uninspiring this past year but I was surprised that he actually finished with an 8.0 K/9, I wouldn't qualify his 7.2 rate from 2012 as a high K rate though. Hughes isn't exactly a strikeout pitcher. He had a 7.5 K/9 last year, that's about league average. Jackson cranked up the strikeouts in 2012 but that seemed to be a mirage as his career K/9 is 6.9. Nearly every other free agent pitcher who could throw it past batters last year was pretty darn good.
    Last edited by nicksaviking; 11-10-2013 at 07:27 PM.

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