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Thread: Hypothetical: Would you have traded Joe Mauer for Fielder or Kinsler?

  1. #21
    Senior Member All-Star James's Avatar
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    Great question.

    Fielder's production has been trending the wrong way. It may not look that way next year when he's hitting home runs all over the place in June in Texas. But, even with that, I'm betting that his best years are behind him.

    Kinsler is an absolute no.
    You can come up with statistics to prove anything. Forty percent of all people know that.

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shane Wahl View Post
    You have to get to true upper-echelon players to consider a trade for Mauer straight up.
    I'm glad someone else appreciates Mauer as much as I do, but Fielder didn't get $30M a year because he was a second tier talent. I'm not saying I'd trade Mauer for these guys either, but I'd be interested to get a couple of names of players that you'd consider.

    Still, it was part of my point with the question is that, especially in Fielder's case, trading Mauer for one of the most durable power hitting 1B in the league isn't a no-brainer.

  3. #23
    Senior Member All-Star Thrylos's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Siehbiscuit View Post
    Not trying to be a jerk, but what other than Fielder being fat gives ANYONE any thought that his body wont hold up? He is currently the leagues "ironman" and he plays first base and DH's! Even if he gets bigger (is it possible?) he can become a full-time DH. Why is he going to breakdown again? Evidence to this?
    Evidence? No, because it is speculation and risk management. Just a red flag that gets much bigger if you look at the fact that his dad broke down after his age 32 season.
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  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alex View Post
    Fielder's contract takes him through age 36 and Mauer's through age 35. Assume Detroit pays the money and they're basically the same.

    That said, I still have concerns about Fielder's potential for decline where I think you might see Mauer actually get better for a season or two.
    I just meant Fielder is signed thru 2020, Mauer 2018.

    If they were both FA, I'd probably like Mauer for 5 years more than Fielder for 7.

  5. #25
    Senior Member All-Star Jim Crikket's Avatar
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    Joe Posnanski has a post where he looks at the "10 worst" contracts right now and Mauer's is one of them. Can't argue, but I didn't see any other contract on the list that I'd swap Mauer for straight up. If you're going to have a "bad contract," I'd keep Mauer and see if a less demanding defensive position means more offensive output and better durability, as opposed to guys like Kinsler or Fielder. I just don't see factors that would indicate either of them will do anything but fade at least a little every year at this point. On top of which, having just one of those other "superstars" wouldn't really improve the competitiveness of the Twins any more than just having Mauer does.

    But the discussion gets different if you start looking at pitchers getting $20MM+/yr. A trade of Mauer for Verlander? He's 30 yrs old and signed through 2019, as I recall. Maybe you would or maybe you wouldn't, but I wouldn't dismiss it out of hand the way I would Fielder and Kinsler.
    I opine about the Twins and Kernels regularly at Knuckleballsblog.com while my alter ego, SD Buhr covers the Kernels for MetroSportsReport.com.

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  6. #26
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    No. But there are probably others I'd trade him for.....but neither of those two.
    Lighten up Francis....

  7. #27
    Senior Member All-Star Shane Wahl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alex View Post
    I'm glad someone else appreciates Mauer as much as I do, but Fielder didn't get $30M a year because he was a second tier talent. I'm not saying I'd trade Mauer for these guys either, but I'd be interested to get a couple of names of players that you'd consider.

    Still, it was part of my point with the question is that, especially in Fielder's case, trading Mauer for one of the most durable power hitting 1B in the league isn't a no-brainer.
    Mike Trout
    Miguel Cabrera
    Bryce Harper
    Evan Longoria
    Wil Myers

    Clayton Kershaw
    David Price
    Max Scherzer
    etc.

    Not a whole bunch of guys, but certainly not falling to Fielder levels.

  8. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Crikket View Post
    Joe Posnanski has a post where he looks at the "10 worst" contracts right now and Mauer's is one of them. Can't argue, but I didn't see any other contract on the list that I'd swap Mauer for straight up. If you're going to have a "bad contract," I'd keep Mauer and see if a less demanding defensive position means more offensive output and better durability, a
    I couldn't find a recent article on this. I saw just the one after the 2011 season and while he mentions Mauer, Mauer wasn't actually in the top 10. It's odd, too considering that he's actually been MORE productive since then.

  9. #29
    Senior Member Big-Leaguer Monkeypaws's Avatar
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    At 1st, Mauer has a chance to age gracefully as a previous poster mentioned. Paul Molitor might be an apt potential comparison.

  10. #30
    Speediest Moderator All-Star snepp's Avatar
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    No and hells no.

  11. #31
    They're both Twins Killers. But no way I trade Mauer for either of them. Not even close.

  12. #32
    Senior Member Big-Leaguer gil4's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Siehbiscuit View Post
    Not trying to be a jerk, but what other than Fielder being fat gives ANYONE any thought that his body wont hold up?
    Really, I think that's enough. Fat players tend to decline early and suddenly, like George Scott, Mo Vaughn, and his dad. David Ortiz seems to be a decent counter-example, but I'm not sure he is in the same class of fat. I can't think of any others, but really there aren't that many fat players, period. (Pitchers are different.)

  13. #33
    Owner All-Star John Bonnes's Avatar
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    I'm surprised. I'm a big Mauer guy, but I think I'd trade him for Fielder and definitely would with the $30M as part of the deal. But I'm also high on Fielder. I think the negative view towards him is driven mostly by a late season slump that extended into the postseason and the fact that we all tend not to trust fat people.

    Im thinking a bit note here - with the other hitters coming up, who would fit the lineup better? Do you want a Fielder-Sano power platoon, or a more traditional 3/4 with a Mauer and Sano? Buxton as a 3 in front of the sluggers is fun to think about - but maybe I'd rather he's clear if them a bit, so he's more likely to steal bases. Hmmmm.....

  14. #34
    Twins Moderator MVP USAFChief's Avatar
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    Mod note: "fat" is rather...inflammatory...may I suggest "husky."
    Every post is not every other post. - a wise man

  15. #35
    Twins Moderator MVP Riverbrian's Avatar
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    Kinsler... No way...

    Fielder... With the Money... I'd pause for a bit before saying.... Naw... Joe is Minnesota.
    A Skeleton walks into a bar and says... "Give me a beer... And a mop".

  16. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by John Bonnes View Post
    I'm surprised. I'm a big Mauer guy, but I think I'd trade him for Fielder and definitely would with the $30M as part of the deal. But I'm also high on Fielder. I think the negative view towards him is driven mostly by a late season slump that extended into the postseason and the fact that we all tend not to trust fat people.
    In athletes it can be pretty damning, and I am having trouble thinking of severely overweight position players that lasted.

    As for slump, it was from May to July where he hit below .800 OPS. Then in August he had an .813 OPS and wrapped up Sept and Oct back to form with a .933 OPS.

    But, overall, I agree with you that it's surprising there haven't been more people willing to commit. I'm not saying I would but with the mentality some have around Mauer and Fielder being a .900+ OPS career hitter and having more power I'm surprised that people wouldn't be willing to take the risk.
    Last edited by Alex; 11-21-2013 at 07:53 PM.

  17. #37
    Senior Member Triple-A
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    No. I expect Mauer to have more value than Fielder at 1B in 2014 and going forward. Fielder is an AWFUL first baseman but I expect Mauer to compete for the gold glove.

  18. #38
    Senior Member All-Star Jim Crikket's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alex View Post
    I couldn't find a recent article on this. I saw just the one after the 2011 season and while he mentions Mauer, Mauer wasn't actually in the top 10. It's odd, too considering that he's actually been MORE productive since then.
    Sorry, I should have included a link.

    http://joeposnanski.com/joeblogs/fie...ler/#more-1092
    I opine about the Twins and Kernels regularly at Knuckleballsblog.com while my alter ego, SD Buhr covers the Kernels for MetroSportsReport.com.

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  19. #39
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    Mauer will age better as a hitter while being a pretty good defensive 1B. I would think about it though. The contracts are basically a wash. Kinsler I would have thought about a little more if not for Dozier/Rosario.

    Its really not that far off though value wise especially considering the concussion fears.
    Last edited by Trevor0333; 11-21-2013 at 09:22 PM.

  20. #40
    Senior Member Triple-A D. Hocking's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by USAFChief View Post
    Mod note: "fat" is rather...inflammatory...may I suggest "husky."
    When I was a kid who might have had a bit of a Prince Fielder build wore jeans that were literally sized "husky". Kids were made fun of if people knew they were wearing "husky" pants. The wonderful world of Tough Skin Jeans.

    I don't really have anything new to add to the actual topic. I am a bit of a homer and think Mauer will probably age better, partially due to his build (unless his knees are already too damaged) and I think his hitting style won't suffer as much from getting older, plus he seems to have a pretty good baseball IQ where I think he will continue to make adjustments to remain effective.

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