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Thread: Fans of other teams thank TR for the Pelfrey signing!

  1. #21
    Senior Member All-Star JB_Iowa's Avatar
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    As always, thanks for the chuckle, Brad.

    I'm not particularly upset by this signing -- more frustrated and resigned, I think. I'm still frustrated that they didn't negotiate a 1 year plus 1 year option last year and that it's 2 full years this time. And I'll be more frustrated when I have to watch him pitch -- I guess I'll just make it a point not to watch on those nights or make darn sure I'm doing something else that occupies 90% of my attention. It just seems that Boras gets a bit of the edge -- seems to convince the Twins that there is a lot of other interest when that may not be true.

  2. #22
    Senior Member Double-A
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    200 innings pitched / 33 starts = 6.06 innings per start. I think he'll get there if takes the ball every fifth day. If Correia makes his 33 starts he gets to 200 also, so does Nolasco. Hughes might, but his career averages show he'll hit about 185-190 if he makes all 33 starts. Because of these pitchers potenetial for injury or ineffectiveness, I think they need to sign Arroyo for stability and durability.

  3. #23
    Owner MVP Brock Beauchamp's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shane Wahl View Post
    Pelfrey's remaining upside is replacement level pitcher. Those can be had for 500K.
    That's just not true at all. The guy had a pretty good three month stretch in 2013 after coming back from surgery. His upside isn't high but it's probably the same as Correia... And Correia, while not an above average pitcher by any means, is definitely better than replacement level.

  4. #24
    Twins News Team All-Star PseudoSABR's Avatar
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    Let's also acknowledge that the Twins arsenal of replacement pitchers is far below what ever median value "replacement level" actually is. Pitchers that get paid above serfdom, I think, are by definition are above replacement.

  5. #25
    Owner MVP Brock Beauchamp's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PseudoSABR View Post
    Let's also acknowledge that the Twins arsenal of replacement pitchers is far below what ever median value "replacement level" actually is. Pitchers that get paid above serfdom, I think, are by definition are above replacement.
    Yep. Despite being absolutely awful for the first half of 2013, Pelfrey was just a touch below "replacement level" for the season (-0.3 BB-Ref WAR).

    People tend to throw around the phrase "replacement level" far too freely. A replacement level player is a player that is absolutely atrocious over a full season. Not bad, atrocious. Coming back from TJS, Mike Pelfrey was a replacement player. There's no reason to expect him to regress from that point while his second half suggests that he can pitch quite a bit better than that.

    Again, I find myself "defending" a signing I don't really care about. It's the type of "meh" move that nobody should really get too up or down about. The problem with last season is that Correia and Pelfrey were "meh" second and third signings... Except they were the first and second signings, which made the offseason a bad one for Twins fans.

    Well, this season Mike Pelfrey is the third signing. A guy signed to fill the back of a rotation and throw innings. This is the type of move the Twins *should* have made last season but didn't sign any quality arms in front of Pelfrey and Correia, making one of them the default "ace" (throws up in mouth a little). Last season, it pissed me off. Thanks to Nolasco and Hughes, this season I don't really care.

  6. #26
    Senior Member Triple-A raindog's Avatar
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    I appreciate the logic and statistics used to defend the signing, but it won't change the fact that the guy is just awful to watch pitch.

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    benchwarmerjim (12-15-2013)

  8. #27
    I don't hate Pelfrey or the move, I hate that this could end up costing us Worley, who I actually has potential to be pretty good for us.

    Maybe that's the "I don't want us to end up losing Revere for nothing" in me, but I just don't feel the upside of Pelfrey is worth losing Diamond, Worley, Deduno...

  9. #28
    Senior Member Triple-A goulik's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by twinscowboysbulls View Post
    I don't hate Pelfrey or the move, I hate that this could end up costing us Worley, who I actually has potential to be pretty good for us.

    Maybe that's the "I don't want us to end up losing Revere for nothing" in me, but I just don't feel the upside of Pelfrey is worth losing Diamond, Worley, Deduno...
    This is my only fear with this off season. Who that we lose will turn into our next Ortiz, Liriano, or Dickey?
    Hendricks? Plouffe? Parmalee? Worley? Gibson? Colabello? Deduno? Albers? We would guess none of them but that was what we said when letting Ortiz and Dickey walk and traded Liriano.

  10. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by goulik View Post
    This is my only fear with this off season. Who that we lose will turn into our next Ortiz, Liriano, or Dickey?
    Hendricks? Plouffe? Parmalee? Worley? Gibson? Colabello? Deduno? Albers? We would guess none of them but that was what we said when letting Ortiz and Dickey walk and traded Liriano.
    Well I'm not taking it to that extreme. Diamond was a rule-5 guy that we gave up no one really(Bullock) to get. Deduno was a FA. Worley is really the only one i'm concerned about. TR obviously saw something in him if he was willing to give up Revere for him and May. If you think Worley was sort of a throw-in on the deal, I'd say you are wrong. The Phillies would've loved to have him this past season(without knowing how he ended up faring in Minnesota)

  11. #30
    Senior Member Triple-A h2oface's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by diehardtwinsfan View Post
    I don't get the hate. He very clearly improved as his season went on, and given that this was his first year back from TJ this was to be expected; he had a pretty good season. As the 3rd pickup, this isn't bad at all.

    Look at his splits:

    By Day/Month ERA W L SV SVO GP GS CG IP H R ER HR BB SO AVG
    April 7.66 2 3 0 0 5 5 0 22.1 36 21 19 2 7 7 .356
    May 5.90 1 3 0 0 6 6 0 29.0 36 19 19 4 12 19 .310
    June 4.66 0 0 0 0 3 3 0 19.1 22 10 10 1 2 12 .293
    July 3.25 1 3 0 0 5 5 0 27.2 28 10 10 3 9 21 .267
    August 3.60 1 1 0 0 6 6 0 35.0 33 15 14 2 16 22 .252
    September 7.45 0 3 0 0 4 4 0 19.1 29 17 16 1 7 20 .341
    I just can't ignore how he finished the season. To improve from April's performance.... well, it would be more amazing if he could have gotten worse than that month, but he made a run for it in September. They all count, as we all painfully witnessed.

  12. #31
    Owner MVP Brock Beauchamp's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by h2oface View Post
    I just can't ignore how he finished the season. To improve from April's performance.... well, it would be more amazing if he could have gotten worse than that month, but he made a run for it in September. They all count, as we all painfully witnessed.
    He sported a BABIP of .431 in September despite striking out 20 batters in 19 innings. He gave up only one home run. Walked too many batters, though (7 in 19 innings).

    Sometimes, luck just ain't on your side.

    Inversely, his July/August sported a BABIP around .250, which is unsustainably low.

  13. #32
    Senior Member Big-Leaguer Monkeypaws's Avatar
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    I can't help but be reminded of a very similar 2 year deal completed last off-season, and the vitriol and doom-foretelling that took place. I expect similar results.

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    goulik (12-15-2013)

  15. #33
    Banned Big-Leaguer
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    Quote Originally Posted by goulik View Post
    This is my only fear with this off season. Who that we lose will turn into our next Ortiz, Liriano, or Dickey?
    Hendricks? Plouffe? Parmalee? Worley? Gibson? Colabello? Deduno? Albers? We would guess none of them but that was what we said when letting Ortiz and Dickey walk and traded Liriano.
    When you're as bad as we were last season, for the sake of progress, there will always be a small chance you're throwing the baby out with the bath water. In defense of the necessity of taking this small chance, we basically held open auditions the past 3 Septembers. I'm so tired of posters talking about this guy being blocked and this guy didn't get this or that guy didn't get that. Well, welcome to Major League Baseball. Also, the prolonged agony of each subtraction on the 40 man roster. Well guess what. The team we watched last season doesn't have 40 players worth protecting at this point in time. Don't look at each individual transaction in a vacuum, look at it within the context of a major rebuilding process being done by a well run organization.
    Last edited by howieramone; 12-15-2013 at 08:11 PM.

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